Stats on wins?

[julian]

Just struck me that there are various court case wins/losses and unenforceability issues covered in the forum. Are there any tallies to give users a view of (likely) successes in generic or % terms?

e.g.
pre 4/2007 agreements

Bank Cases Win Lose
Abbey (12) always never (no CCA kept)
Barclaycard (151) sometimes often (by default)

Are any agreements consistently unenforceable/unavailable?
Which DCAs go to court?

post 4/2007 agreements
Which banks/DCAs go to court?

It would be interesting to see what to expect, but of course so would the rest of the world. Unenforceability should remain the same, but the modus operandi of the banks and DCAs may change re court claims.

[julian]

Re: Stats on wins?

Sorry didn't manage the table very well.

[jen_br]

Re: Stats on wins?

I personally don't feel this would be a fair assessment. I mean each case is individual and I think it would give a lot of false hope.

No two agreements from any same bank at any same time are the same and must be treated as such

but your right a comparative analysis would be interesting.

[ken100464]

Re: Stats on wins?

Be difficult I would think on the Bank/DCA bit as every debt is different.

Think Paul has nailed it tho. Ignoring or not following up would increase likely action even if it is just to (wrongly) lull the litigator into a default probable mode.

[Pixie]

Re: Stats on wins?

It's far more complex than a simple tally.

A lot of people are way down the line...some even with court cases already looming...when they join the forum so any table would not be a true reflection.

Read through the diaries to see which dcas are likely to back off and which are more tenacious.

[julian]

Re: Stats on wins?

True. Stats would not necessarily match all expectations, but for those in the forum showing that success is feasible in some cases would be soothing.

Hope is the expectation that something might happen.
Belief is the expectation that something will happen.

Statistical data normally comes with a warning identifying the constraints to avoid misinterpretation. As the forum has the data from its limited sample of users, unless it is all "lies, damned lies" then the statistics would be interesting even if not specific to any particular case.

The course of action expounded is to confront the issues, before they get to court if possible. That would be nice. However, when there is no way to avoid it, for whatever reason, but normally because you cannot make any payments, hope is the only reason to keep on breathing even where it is False Hope vs No Hope.

With constant threats and humiliations, it is difficult to see whether there will ever be an end to the misery. Once there is a glimmer of hope then there could be the impetus to come out from behind the settee and respond to the threats.

[jon1965]

Re: Stats on wins?

Peoples personal financial decisions are also variable. For example is it worth issuing proceedings against someone with no assets lots of creditors and no job especially if there is any likelihood they may not work for some time, however someone with valuable assets such as several properties or a business may be a much better prospect.

[Pixie]

Re: Stats on wins?

That's a very good point Jon.

I was taken to court for a post 2007 credit card...I didn't defend and the creditor got a ccj against me with payments of £1 a month. It's going to be a very long time before it's paid off...in fact it never will be, given my age and financial position.

[julian]

Re: Stats on wins?

Pixie, I expect that many are in that position, which is why they have come to the forum. Many will probably leave when they have overcome their current issues. If there are currently no tallies there are none, which answers my question.

The stats could only be built up manually by users by looking at each and every entry, which may not be complete because the views are limited for security.

If, and only if, it were considered useful and the tools and the time were available to the Site Administrators to interrogate the threads, the forum management would be able to provide them more easily and centrally. e.g. individual motorists know their own case, and what they read in the local newspapers, but the Home Office produces annual figures on all motoring offences in the UK, from there they can see that Cheshire tends to prosecute M6 speedsters and the Met has more fixed penalties etc, but it does not mean the Met doesn't prosecute for speeding.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Stats on wins?

If, and only if, it were considered useful and the tools and the time were available to the Site Administrators to interrogate the threads, the forum management would be able to provide them more easily and centrally.

As already said above, the stats would be flawed and incorrect. For example, a lot of people with judgments may not bother, due to having no equitable assets or maybe they have no money so just don't care if the lender gets a default judgment, yet others will fight and maybe lose on a judge's biased decision making skills or appeal a previously incorrect judgment (which could mean 1 case with 2 losses before a success if appealed right up the chain...) so to ask for stats is quite impossible.

As far as it goes, we work to the ethos each case has it;s own merits and no two will be the same, they can't be unless you had two identical accounts taken the same day by different people, that paid and stopped paying at the same time and had the same after cessation hassle/legal threats and then the same judge. It is impossible.

Try not to worry about stats, stats mean nothing in a legal sense - we rely on case law and precedent. You can have a loss (Carey) that provides case law and precedence as it clarifies a lot of things and we can use parts of that judgment to then beat others so even though that was technically a consumer loss, overall I bet it has helped to win 100's of consumer cases as it set clear guidelines on several discrepancies that we were previously losing on.

Hope this makes more sense...

[ken100464]

Re: Stats on wins?

Think its an admirable idea but the variables are just astronomical.

You get a flavour by coming on here regularly.

You are right many stop coming except when there is a problem looming. Thats good because real life takes over again and that must be seen as a success.

Various Banks/DCA's have different litigation tactics or none at all.

1st Credit were (and should still be) deemed extremely dangerous. However there is a good chance on here someone could help you.

Arrow have for various reasons been very active recently and probably the most dangerous at the moment.

Marlin another, Lewis you just keep going. They are all dangerous if you fall into their parameters.

Like salt n Vinegar said recently. The idea is to get to a stand off with any or all of them.

How you do that is another variable. Miss a template/letter, be late, get the new boy at the DCA wanting to make a name for themselves it just becomes enourmous.

The diaries give the flavour as it is now. But next year it will be all changed.

Mass Assignments seem to always bring a flurry as does xmas.

[julian]

Re: Stats on wins?

Thanks for the discussion. I was just wondering if there could be a shortcut, so will slink away.

Time and timing seems to be the essence when to fight and when to sit down and sulk.
"
1st Credit were (and should still be) deemed extremely dangerous. However there is a good chance on here someone could help you. such lovely people from what I have read, and so discrete, they have won so many awards for pissing people off and making their lives a misery

Arrow have for various reasons been very active recently and probably the most dangerous at the moment.

Marlin another, Lewis you just keep going. They are all dangerous if you fall into their parameters. Do they take it in turns to be nasty? I relaise that the aim of DCA like factoring in the old days is to collect delinquent debts, just the margins are so high nowadays.

Like salt n Vinegar said recently. The idea is to get to a stand off with any or all of them.See one off and another lower life form takes over

How you do that is another variable. Miss a template/letter, be late, get the new boy at the DCA wanting to make a name for themselves it just becomes enourmous.especially with the high turnover of staff as they don't meet their objectives or their OTE

The diaries give the flavour as it is now. But next year it will be all changed. do you mean different? I hope any new legislation will assist us rather than them!

Mass Assignments seem to always bring a flurry as does xmas.

[ken100464]

Re: Stats on wins?

You get it. All variable and all changing all the time.

Was a good thread though.