creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

[jackreacher]

If an agreement is not signed by the creditor, so an unexecuted agreement. My question is; does the creditor have the legal right to charge late fees interest etc.

My own opinion is no! I appreciate he may be able to sign in the court room, if so that would not entitle him to backdate interest etc.

Would certainly help with counterclaim.

All chat welcome..

[cymruambyth]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

Is there a date stamp? DJ told me that that was acceptable as signature.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

Is there a date stamp? DJ told me that that was acceptable as signature.

Sorry to hear that, could you not find a it must be signed and dated anywhere.

Yes there is a date stamp.. but there is a separate place for signature. I will use waksman para 7, 10, etc must be signed in the prescribed manner.
I think it says somewhere it should be a sign and date somewhere in the FCA or ?? will definitely look for proof of both having to be done.
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[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

I don't think it holds weight. I'd not rely on it.....

[Enforcer]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

Went through this with Barclaycard, unexecuted agreement! read what Judge Wacksman says.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

Went through this with Barclaycard, unexecuted agreement! read what Judge Wacksman says.

Enforcer.. Could you be more specific. Paragraphs or thoughts. I have read Waksman a few times but mainly for showing reconstituted are not for proof purpose( in one of my other cases).

Have to get something together by tomorrow.

Niddy not relying on it.. may useful. especially as my case is I never signed or filled in the agreement.. and now neither have they. My sig is on there but I never signed it and I can prove the agreement is knocked. Front and reverse have different parties to the agreement...lol
And the sig is dodgy as it runs through some printed words but no ink appears within the printed letters? Before and after but not in. Non of the info is correct and filled in by someone else and they refused my offer of a shared handwriting expert.

I have stronger points than above but it interested me as to the answer , particular as to counter claim.

[cymruambyth]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

I did quote loads to support this as one of many arguments. DJ stated that date stamp in signature. Box made it an executed agreement. DJ did spout quite a lot of drivel !

[Enforcer]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

We had a long discussion about this on the forum. Rubber stamping, or wet signature. Paul went through it in some detail, Barclaycard tried this argument with me. Perhaps one of the mods could find the posts.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

We had a long discussion about this on the forum. Rubber stamping, or wet signature. Paul went through it in some detail, Barclaycard tried this argument with me. Perhaps one of the mods could find the posts.

I am happy they can rubber stamp Lloyds plc (or similar).. I will argue when there are two boxes, one for the date and one for the Signature and only the date is filled in then they have not signed it. I will probably raise it under cover of a question, " if I as the claimant had dated the document but not signed it , do you agree that it would be an unexecuted agreement" then turn it upon them.

Apparently it does have force over interest to be charged etc. Strangely in this agreement they have left out the amount for charges as well.. so I will be arguing they had no lawful agreement allowing them to charge me late fees etc.

An executed agreement is binding on both parties but an unexecuted agreement is:

1. I:30.47 goode

It will be recalled that an unexecuted agreement is a prospective regulated agreement which, though reduced to writing, lacks contractual force, either because it remains to be signed by one or more of the parties or because the offeree has not yet communicated his acceptance of the other party's offer.

[ATW]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

The company stamping the agreement is ok for its signature.

If they haven't signed it in any way then they need to apply within the Particulars of Claim for the agreement to be enforceable. If they make that application it is highly likely to succeed. Take a look at s127 (1) CCA 1974. The onus would be on you to show that them not signing the agreement prejudiced you in some way so that the agreement should remain unenforceable due to lack of signature by the creditor and i think that would be extremely difficult to prove.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

The company stamping the agreement is ok for its signature.

If they haven't signed it in any way then they need to apply within the Particulars of Claim for the agreement to be enforceable. If they make that application it is highly likely to succeed. Take a look at s127 (1) CCA 1974. The onus would be on you to show that them not signing the agreement prejudiced you in some way so that the agreement should remain unenforceable due to lack of signature by the creditor and i think that would be extremely difficult to prove.

I am only really using it as I am saying "I never signed the agreement, strangely enough neither did you".

However as the 'parties to the agreement' on the front signature page are different to the 'parties to the agreemeent' on the alleged rear where the Prescribed terms are, it could be argued they would need the court to enforce twice. ( I will switch this to my Lloyds thread)

The fact they have now told me they are not bringing the agreement to the hearing has put me at a big disadvantage.

[ATW]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

If you can show that you did not sign the agreement then its game over for them.

If you have done a s78 request than that may save you here too. They have not complied because the T&CS do not relate to that agreement. They relate to a different one between different parties.

why are they not bringing the agreement to the hearing? Take your copy which shows that what they have sent you is wrong. Sloppy archiving.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

If you can show that you did not sign the agreement then its game over for them.

If you have done a s78 request than that may save you here too. They have not complied because the T&CS do not relate to that agreement. They relate to a different one between different parties.

why are they not bringing the agreement to the hearing? Take your copy which shows that what they have sent you is wrong. Sloppy archiving.

Still chewing the fat over this unexecuted agreement.

How can they have complied with s78 when that requires them to send a copy of the executed agreement... ditto s63. surely they can not backdate the signature.. LOL

[ATW]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

Still chewing the fat over this unexecuted agreement.

How can they have complied with s78 when that requires them to send a copy of the executed agreement... ditto s63. surely they can not backdate the signature.. LOL

I agree that they have not complied with s78. Thats what I wrote. They have not sent you the whole agreement so they have not complied. Have a look at Phoenix v Kotecha at paragraph 7.

[jackreacher]

Re: creditor not signed agreement can he charge interest and fees?

I agree that they have not complied with s78. Thats what I wrote. They have not sent you the whole agreement so they have not complied. Have a look at Phoenix v Kotecha at paragraph 7.

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Thanks Andrew all understood now