Idem servicing

[stuffthebanks]

Hi all, hope things are ok with you...
I have a debt that was originally with Mint, it went to court, i was very inexperienced back then and ended up with a CCJ and charging order on my house.
It was set at the hearing that i should pay £150 per month on the debt, which then stood at £18000, and the judge made it a condition that provided that amount was paid each month the charging order would not be enforced.
I have been paying that amount for some time now, over 6 years in fact, never missed a single payment.
Arden were the collection agents for the last few years, however i recently received a letter from a company called Idem servicing who advised me that they would now be acting as collection agents for the debt.
The debt now stands at just over £7000.
I have cancelled the standing order with Arden and the new order set up with Idem for the amount of £150 per month.
I have today received another letter from Idem saying they accept my offer of £150 per month, but have said they would review after 3 months.
They have also enclosed an income and expenditure form for me to fill in.

My question is, if anyone would be able to help, is:
If the original judgement was for £150.00 per month can this lot change the amount i have paid since the original judgement?

I have no correspondence from the court who gave me the judgement.
I am wary of this one simply because of the amount and the fact it has a charging order attached.

Any advice will be most welcome.

Thanks

Steve

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Idem servicing

Affordability is key. So no they need to go to court to increase it but because it's a high amount, you might not be able to afford the repayments and if they don't verify affordability you *could* end up in severe hardship and thus get compo from them.

You don't need to do anything if you're happy at £150pm. You can, if you wanted, consider a F&F to get rid if you had 50% to settle with....

[stuffthebanks]

Re: Idem servicing

Affordability is key. So no they need to go to court to increase it but because it's a high amount, you might not be able to afford the repayments and if they don't verify affordability you *could* end up in severe hardship and thus get compo from them.

You don't need to do anything if you're happy at £150pm. You can, if you wanted, consider a F&F to get rid if you had 50% to settle with....

Top man Nidd's....thanks for the reply mate...

So would i need to fill in the income and expenditure form, having read through it again, they do say they need to assess my ability to pay, 3 months initial fixed at £150.. and on them working out from my I& E form they would fix for 12 months.

If the court fixed at £150, and i can prove from my current situation that its too high, would i then actually be able to pay less per month.

Sorry to sound so dim on this one mate, its just the charging order that spooks me.....

I would love to be in a position to make an offer Nidd's....not gonna happen though, not unless i have a rich benifactor somewhere, or i win the lottery....

Thanks again mate, i appreciate the advice very much.

[Deepie]

Re: Idem servicing

So would i need to fill in the income and expenditure form,.

I wouldn't if it were me ...I'm paying £25 per month on a 8k ccj and 2nd charge

[cymruambyth]

Re: Idem servicing

The amount is agreed by the court so they would have to go to court to increase and then your I&e would be needed.

[PlanB]

Re: Idem servicing

ended up with a CCJ and charging order on my house.

It was set at the hearing that i should pay £150 per month on the debt, which then stood at £18000, and the judge made it a condition that provided that amount was paid each month the charging order would not be enforced.

. . . . they accept my offer of £150 per month, but have said they would review after 3 months.

. . . . If the original judgement was for £150.00 per month can this lot change the amount i have paid since the original judgement?

I have no correspondence from the court who gave me the judgement.

Could you clarify something.

Was the original CCJ an 'instalment' Order of £150 per month?

Or was the original CCJ a 'forthwith' Order (the whole sum due usually within 14 days) but at the subsequent Charging Order hearing the DJ made an Order that there would be no Order for Sale on the condition that you maintained payments of £150 per month in respect of the CCJ?

These may be two separate legal issues arising from two different court hearings resulting in two court Orders. The CO is enforcement of the CCJ.

In either case I believe the Claimant or the Defendant has the right to make an application to the court to vary the Order(s) upwards or downwards.

Have you got copies of the two Orders (the original CCJ and the Charging Order)?

The court wouldn't correspond with you unless an application had been made.

Having said that Idem have written to you to say they accept your offer of £150 for the next three months so why not put this to the back of your mind for the next three months once we've clarified your legal position.

Plan B x

[PlanB]

Re: Idem servicing

they need to go to court to increase it but because it's a high amount, you might not be able to afford the repayments and if they don't verify affordability you *could* end up in severe hardship and thus get compo from them..

I expect that's why they have sent the OP an I & E Form to establish what he can realistically afford to pay before making any application to vary the court Order, although I'm not sure what compo could be claimed since it's the court (a DJ) who would order the amount payable not the creditor or their agent.

The DJ would base his decision on an I & E with evidence sought to support it if necessary.

Plan B x

[PlanB]

Re: Idem servicing

If the court fixed at £150, and i can prove from my current situation that its too high, would i then actually be able to pay less per month.

Are you struggling to make these payments so need to reduce them?

As I posted earlier either party may have the right to apply to vary the Order especially if your financial circumstances have changed/deteriorated in the last six years since the Order was made.

Plan B x

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Idem servicing

I expect that's why they have sent the OP an I & E Form to establish what he can realistically afford to pay before making any application to vary the court Order, although I'm not sure what compo could be claimed since it's the court (a DJ) who would order the amount payable not the creditor or their agent.

The DJ would base his decision on an I & E with evidence sought to support it if necessary.

Plan B x

Yea granted the DJ would have assessed it at judgment but things change and a payment schedule should always be reviewed against affordability. Even courts have to abide by affordability.

Even post judgment the FOS could find against a firm who abused a debtor. So if the debt was sold and the new owner doesn't do affordability and then the debtor went to the FOS; even though the court set the payments it's the duty of the creditor to ensure the debtor isn't in financial hardship. Their duty of care must override profit in all instances.

I was kinda highlighting a worse case scenario of reasons why they issued I&E. But so long as the original amount is paid Each month as per the judgment neither party can change that without a judge rubber stamping it.

[stuffthebanks]

Re: Idem servicing

I wouldn't if it were me ...I'm paying £25 per month on a 8k ccj and 2nd charge

Thanks Deepie, appreciate your response.

[stuffthebanks]

Re: Idem servicing

The amount is agreed by the court so they would have to go to court to increase and then your I&e would be needed.

Thanks Cym for the response, it is appreciated.

[stuffthebanks]

Re: Idem servicing

Are you struggling to make these payments so need to reduce them?

As I posted earlier either party may have the right to apply to vary the Order especially if your financial circumstances have changed/deteriorated in the last six years since the Order was made.

Plan B x

Hi PB,
I did struggle to make the payments of £150 when it first started 6-7 years ago, but over time i make the payments without any hardship involved.
I just want to get this one paid off as quickly as possible, and at the current amount it works fine.
As far as the court order goes, i have to admit to being in a dark place when all this was going on and it all kind of went over my head.
If my memory serves me right though , i am fairly sure i only went to court once with the debt.
My biggest problem is that a lot of paperwork i had during this period has been stored away in my loft, i will have to try and find it.
I do not remember having anything from the court after my hearing to confirm what the judge had said regarding payments.

I guess i need to find the paperwork fairly quickly to enable a clearer picture, which i will do over the next week or so.
Should i hang fire on an i&e for now?

I really do appreciate all the help given, and my apologies for appearing so dim with this one....

Thank you as always
Steve

[PlanB]

Re: Idem servicing

As far as the court order goes, i have to admit to being in a dark place when all this was going on and it all kind of went over my head. . . i am fairly sure i only went to court once with the debt.

. . . I do not remember having anything from the court after my hearing to confirm what the judge had said regarding payments.

The court which granted the charging order would have been the same court which granted the CCJ in the first place.

Following the CCJ the Claimant must apply for an Interim CO and then the court will inform the Defendant of a hearing date to decide whether or not to grant a final CO.

From what you say you attended the initial hearing but not the CO hearing which may have resulted in the CO going ahead because it was uncontested (by you).

CO hearings tend to be listed for 5 mins since the majority of Defendants don't show up believing they have no hope of challenging it despite DJs having discretion to refuse a CO (sadly not many do) and having the power to add conditions to a CO such as no Order for Sale if you pay a set amount or do xyz or until the children have reached 18 yrs old etc. The DJ won't add the conditions unless the Defendant goes to the hearing and asks for them.

Both Orders would have been sent to you in the post at the time. A copy of both Orders should still be available from the court so why not call them to get them sent (there may be a fee to pay) if you can't find them in your loft.

If the CCJ was an instalment Order of £150 per month then the current debt owner can't argue with that unless they make an application to the court to vary it.

From what you say it seems safe not to return the I & E at this point depending on what is written on the CCJ.

Don't let Idem spook you. Is your home in joint names or your sole name? If it's in joint names then the CO will be a Restriction which only comes into play when the property is sold.

Plan B x

[stuffthebanks]

Re: Idem servicing

PB i cannot thank you enough, along with all the other very helpful response from the other forum members...i really do appreciate the advice given.
I know i have the charging order info tucked away, but i dont ever remember recieving the CCJ through the post.
I will contact the court for the information.
The charging order was sent to both me and my OH....the mortgage is in joint names..
And we have no intention of selling any time soon....
The house is also on a 50 -50 shared ownership with a local housing authority.
I will hang fire for now like you suggest on the i&e.
I intend to go into the loft this afternoon to look for paper work.........i may be some time....

Many thanks again for the brilliant help.....

[PlanB]

Re: Idem servicing

The charging order was sent to both me and my OH....the mortgage is in joint names..

The house is also on a 50 -50 shared ownership with a local housing authority.

So the property is in joint names which means the CO will be a Restriction. You've very little to fear.

I'll need to look into your specific legal situation vis-a-vis shared ownership with the Local Authority. In theory you only own 50% of the property and your OH owns 50% of that 50% so I'd like to think it would be damn difficult for the creditor to cause you problems while you continue to make the agreed payments.

Plan B x