Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

[SXGuy]

Hi guys. Just want to rack some of your brains regarding this.

My wife previously worked 5 days a week, since shes been on maternity she has racked up enough holidays to entitle her to have 2 days off a week for the next 4 months.

She is about to ask her boss if she can come back to work after maternity ends for 3 days a week.

But shes worried he will say no.

Im not positive but I thought I read somewhere that an employer has to take in to consideration her circumstances once shes had a child, is this correct?

Is there any legal basis whereby she can ask to work reduced amount of days whilst our child is not in any type of child care yet?

She does have some "easing back in" days allocated but I think that's just a day a week for the first few months until shes properly due to start back.

[oscar]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Not too up on the pregnancy stuff, I know with illness, a manager cannot refuse your holiday entitlement if the amount is still there.
Might be an idea to run this question past Tasty Jane

[tastyjane]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Hi, you are talking about 2 different things here. Firstly if it's a temporary change to use up accrued holiday then she just needs to submit holiday requests as normal, as long as she has the allowance and has given enough notice as per her contract they should be ok with it ( your wife has a right to take holiday). If in fact you are looking to fundamentally change her contracted hours under flexible working that is a very different process, if that's what you are looking to do let me know and I'll talk you through the process but please be mindful there is no obligation on the employer to accept your proposals.

Jane x

[malamute]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Hi, you are talking about 2 different things here. Firstly if it's a temporary change to use up accrued holiday then she just needs to submit holiday requests as normal, as long as she has the allowance and has given enough notice as per her contract they should be ok with it ( your wife has a right to take holiday). If in fact you are looking to fundamentally change her contracted hours under flexible working that is a very different process, if that's what you are looking to do let me know and I'll talk you through the process but please be mindful there is no obligation on the employer to accept your proposals.

Jane x

I asked for an adjustment to my hours on return to maternity leave (no later than 5pm given team worked til 6) and I was told no. I was told that you can ask but they cannot guarentee agreeing to it.

BUT when I moved to a new employer I was able to negotiate my hours upon joining the company. So it largely depends on culture of where she works, what she does and if there are others with similar arrangements.

Not exact but largely she should know that she can ask!

[SXGuy]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Thanks guys, that clarifies things.

I was talking of two different things, firstly she wanted to know if she had any legal standing to change her hours, and if not, then I think she was going to request her accrued holiday to be taken twice a week for the next few months in order for her to be paid full time but only work 3 days a week. After that im not sure what she plans on doing. I think shes hoping to be pregnant again by then.

Long story regarding her work, but they have basically been taken over by new employers, who wish to move her office from Loughton to Wanstead, about another 30 to 45 min jounery, which she really doesn't want to do (I cant blame her) but im not sure if that distance is far enough to be considered for voluntary redundancy.

I guess she would like to look for another job working 3 days a week but its unlikely she will find one.

Her manager is understanding so may be on her side, its just putting it to the new employers that shes concerned about. On one hand, they have done ok without her for the last 9 months, so may agree to it, on the other, they may want her to get back in to work full time.

Only time will tell I guess!

[oscar]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Long story regarding her work, but they have basically been taken over by new employers, who wish to move her office from Loughton to Wanstead, about another 30 to 45 min jounery, which she really doesn't want to do (I cant blame her) but im not sure if that distance is far enough to be considered for voluntary redundancy.

Might be best to check with Jane again when shes online, but I would have thought that TUPE would still have kicked in. Suppose it depends on when the takeover was and whether it is still within the timeframe.

[SXGuy]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Might be best to check with Jane again when shes online, but I would have thought that TUPE would still have kicked in. Suppose it depends on when the takeover was and whether it is still within the timeframe.

TUPE still in place, theres no issue here i dont think.

[malamute]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

In terms of redudnacy etc - Jane is defo the one.

But experience of colleagues and friends is that request it before you go back - don't return to work then say you want to change your hours.

[SXGuy]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Shes text her manager to ask him to ring when hes free for a chat. I also know him through designing a website for his other business, and he seems a reasonable guy, its her new employers who she has not seen in practise since they have came in during her maternity leave.

I guess they have no idea of her proformance at work as well for the same reason, so it could go either way really.

[malamute]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Shes text her manager to ask him to ring when hes free for a chat. I also know him through designing a website for his other business, and he seems a reasonable guy, its her new employers who she has not seen in practise since they have came in during her maternity leave.

I guess they have no idea of her proformance at work as well for the same reason, so it could go either way really.

All the best! From experience its a hard conversation but sometime the thought of having that conversation with a boss is harder than the conversation itself!

Hope she gets the arrangement she wants

[tastyjane]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Hi again, sorry it's George's birthday today so yesterday was taken up with bumble bee cakes and party bags when he goes to school I'll write a longer response but with regards to travel time as always it's pretty ambiguous unless stated in the TUPE terms. Will usually be "reasonable" but how people define reasonable can vary in a case to case basis.

Jane x

[jules3107]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

Morning All,

Just going on my daughters experiences, she had her back to work interview last week after being on Maternity Leave this past 6 months.

She has asked for different days and hours until further notice, and they say yes apparently its part and parcel of returning to work these days.

I found this during a search;-

Can I change my working hours?

You have the right to ask for part-time or flexible hours and your employer has a duty to seriously consider your request.
If they don’t have a good business reason for refusing, you may be able to rely on sex discrimination law to challenge the decision.
Requesting flexible working hours involves a clear procedure, which you and your employer must follow. It can take up to 14 weeks and needs to be in place before you return to work.
You should make a written application and your employer must then arrange a meeting to discuss it within 28 days of your initial request.


What are my working options?

There are many different types of flexible working to consider:

• Part time - only working part of the week
• Home working - working some or part of your week at home
• Job sharing - sharing your role responsibilities with someone else
• Compressed hours - working your hours over fewer days
• Flexi time - choosing when to work as long as it amounts to a set number of hours
• Annualised hours - your hours are worked out over a year
• Staggered hours - different starting, break and finishing times

When exploring these options with your employer, remember that you can combine more than one of these options.
But also remember that your employer will be more amenable to the option that works best for the business.

Jules x

[tastyjane]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

OK so we are now talking about 2 things; potential redundancy or transfer by TUPE and flexible working. Let's take the flexible working first; although Jules is right to quote the above in my experience unless you can show a clear case of discrimination you are very much in the hands of the employer. It is important that you wife writes with her request including strong business reasons why her change in hours will offer no detriment to the company and if at all possible why it could enhance her/their performance. The classic is where someone wants to start work early and finish early so providing enhanced telephone cover....

However, especially with smaller companies, it is easy for the company to respond that it would have a negative impact on the business, from an employers point of view although job share is a great idea it can often be difficult to sell the idea. Legislation protects us when pregnant and on maternity leave and part of the protection is that your job will be available to you in the same form when you return, consequently companies often take on a temporary employee on the same hours etc to cover so replacing like with like, consider then if the original employee wants to come back on reduced hours, the employer will have a reduction in service and will have to go out and recruit someone to cover the additional hours.... She needs to get her letter with her proposals in as soon as possible, again as Jules stated there are timescales to adhere to and once she is back working full time they are (in my opinion) less likely to be happy to reduce. With all that said its definitely worth a try as many companies will accommodate reduced hours particularly if they are looking to save overheads.

With regards to redundancy, I would have thought that unless they state an actual "reasonable" distance to expect a returning mum to travel an additional 45 minutes each way each day is not that reasonable. I would ask for an informal "off the record and without prejudice" chat with the HR department and go over your wife's options. The benefit to being made redundant is that she should receive a lump sum tax free (dependant on age and length of service) and maybe her notice period paid in lieu. Also she would be eligible for JSA immediately if she was made redundant.

If you want me to read through her flexible working request I'd be happy to do so, just PM me and good luck.

Jane x

[SXGuy]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

OK so we are now talking about 2 things; potential redundancy or transfer by TUPE and flexible working. Let's take the flexible working first; although Jules is right to quote the above in my experience unless you can show a clear case of discrimination you are very much in the hands of the employer. It is important that you wife writes with her request including strong business reasons why her change in hours will offer no detriment to the company and if at all possible why it could enhance her/their performance. The classic is where someone wants to start work early and finish early so providing enhanced telephone cover....

However, especially with smaller companies, it is easy for the company to respond that it would have a negative impact on the business, from an employers point of view although job share is a great idea it can often be difficult to sell the idea. Legislation protects us when pregnant and on maternity leave and part of the protection is that your job will be available to you in the same form when you return, consequently companies often take on a temporary employee on the same hours etc to cover so replacing like with like, consider then if the original employee wants to come back on reduced hours, the employer will have a reduction in service and will have to go out and recruit someone to cover the additional hours.... She needs to get her letter with her proposals in as soon as possible, again as Jules stated there are timescales to adhere to and once she is back working full time they are (in my opinion) less likely to be happy to reduce. With all that said its definitely worth a try as many companies will accommodate reduced hours particularly if they are looking to save overheads.

Before she left on maternity, she put forward the idea of training two existing staff members below her, to carry out her duties whilst she was on maternity, she also aranged with her manager a contract for them which said they can have a pay rise during the maternity period, but it would cease once she came back, as the extra work would no longer be needed from them. Everyone agreed to this and a contract was signed.

So she could argue in theory, that as this is happening now while shes off work, a reduction in working hours would be of no loss to the company, since the two staff members are now trained to perform her duties, they could continue wit a payrise pro rata for the days my wife would no longer be working.

The only sticking point, is the fact that neither the new employers or her, have every worked together since the change over is happening now, whilst she is on maternity leave.

So if they dont know how efficient she is, they may be less inclined to accept it.

Around the time shes due to go back to work is year end for the company, and she is usually incharge of prepairing for audit, again that may go against them agreeing to anything.

With regards to redundancy, I would have thought that unless they state an actual "reasonable" distance to expect a returning mum to travel an additional 45 minutes each way each day is not that reasonable. I would ask for an informal "off the record and without prejudice" chat with the HR department and go over your wife's options. The benefit to being made redundant is that she should receive a lump sum tax free (dependant on age and length of service) and maybe her notice period paid in lieu. Also she would be eligible for JSA immediately if she was made redundant.

If you want me to read through her flexible working request I'd be happy to do so, just PM me and good luck.

Jane x

Her contract mentions something about being required to work from a reasonble distance, however im unsure of the exact wording. She believes that if they move location and add anoter 30 to 45 minute journey each way, it may not be seen as an unreasonble distance. If it had been, they would have to offer her redundancy which she would more than likely take, as it would cover her for 3 months, and then her insurance kicks in and pays a years salary.

If she could also argue working less days a week is fair considering they will potentially move location and increase her travel costs, that could be another plus surely?

She spoke to HR before she left work, and they said, they had no issue with her taking her accured holiday 2 days a week, she has 28 days left at the moment.

[tastyjane]

Re: Wife going back to work after a baby - can she ask for less days?

It sounds like she has a very fair case to reduce her hours under flexible working if by her going back part-time the other two people will just drop some of their additional responsibilities. She needs to set out how she sees that working in practice and add a couple of positives to the company - I would have thought that there would be 3 people trained up in all aspects of the role and up to date with current issues would be a huge plus.

As I said there is really no definition to reasonable - if redundancy is her preference I would start dialogue with the new employer as soon as possible. The fact that she has been on maternity leave and will therefore have a child who one would assume would be in childcare to me makes that extra travelling time unreasonable. Talk to them about what time your wife would have to leave home with the child and the fact that the child would be travelling for in excess of 1 1/2 hours a day. If they have existing staff that are covering her job then they might be glad of the opportunity to offer redundancy but in my experience if she doesn't mention it to them they are unlikely to push it as the first thing you learn about redundancy is don't touch pregnant/people on maternity leave with a barge pole :-).

Jane x