Tenancy Agreement Advice

[Miss Daffodil]

Hi

I have been recommended to this site, so I'm hoping someone willbe able to advise me.

I own a house which I rent out to 5 lovely students (as from the1st September this is their second year contract with me) I have a very goodLandlord/student relationship with all of them.

The house as a large back garden, which I have recently beengranted planning permission to build a 2 bedroomed bungalow in. Thestudents are aware of this but, I have only given them limited information ona 'need to know' basis, so not to worry them.

One of the students loves the garden and tells me whenever we speak!!!! The student house will be left with a small courtyard garden.

I am now going to put the land with the planning permission onsale with the local estate agent and not instruct builders myself.

The Tenancy Agreement states : To keep the garden neat and tidyand not to have open fires. NO mention of the size of the plot.

I don't want to get into a legal battle or start falling out withthem, but equally I want to go forward with this.

Please could anyone direct me and I would greatly appreciate youradvise on this.

Thank you.

Daffodil

[PriorityOne]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

This is not really my area but I think you've been fair and considerate (so far) by letting them know a little of what you've got in mind.

The rent you're charging is based upon the facilities they have at the moment.... and the garden they are currently enjoying is part of that. If this is the second year of their tenancy, I suspect they won't be there for much longer, so could you defer your plans or is this not an option? If not, would you be prepared to re-negotiate the rent a bit to ease the transition from a bigger to much smaller garden?

[SXGuy]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Your tenants may be the last of your worries, as any planning permission will be subject to locals objecting. They will find out in the end because a notice will be placed outside nearby somewhere, so best to keep them informed.

[PlanB]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

I own a house which I rent out to 5 lovely students (as from the1st September this is their second year contract with me) I have a very goodLandlord/student relationship with all of them.

The house as a large back garden, which I have recently beengranted planning permission to build a 2 bedroomed bungalow in. Thestudents are aware of this but, I have only given them limited information ona 'need to know' basis, so not to worry them.

One of the students loves the garden and tells me whenever we speak!!!! The student house will be left with a small courtyard garden.

I am now going to put the land with the planning permission onsale with the local estate agent and not instruct builders myself.

The Tenancy Agreement states : To keep the garden neat and tidyand not to have open fires. NO mention of the size of the plot.

I don't want to get into a legal battle or start falling out withthem, but equally I want to go forward with this.

This is a tricky one because it involves both moral and legal arguments.

If they are students on a traditional 3 year university course then they may be planning on staying in the property another year after this one. But if you're already aware that the large garden is the main attraction to them (probably) you may find they won't want to stay once it's vanished. Then you'll be left with trying to find replacement tenants who are willing to live with a noisy building site only a few feet from the house. Not so easy. The house will never again achieve the same rent as you are now getting once it has only a courtyard instead of a large garden.

If they've already signed a tenancy agreement from September 1st then it's probably best not to drop the bombshell until after that date because that will make it harder for them to challenge their contract once it's up and running rather than simply pull out now. But they will have the legal right to challenge that contract on the basis that the property (which would include the garden) they rented is not the same property they've now got once the garden is reduced in size. I can see them winning that argument in court. The likely remedy would be for the court to release them from the contract early and (possibly) make you pay for their removal costs and any other inconvenience costs (like an unused Sky or BT contract which has to be bought out). But you never know they might not give a damn if they're on a tight budget and you drop the rent.

I don't think the actual size of the garden needs to be mentioned in the AST - room sizes are never mentioned either. But it would have been mentioned in the inventory which would have been referred to in the AST so it's part of the contract (sort of). Even if there is no mention of it anywhere they could still successfully argue that the large garden was there when they moved in and you can't deny that.

If you're only just putting the land on the market then there will be a period of time before the sale completes and work starts when the tenants would be in ignorance of these impending changes. This is where the moral argument kicks in. You already know that this major disruption is going to happen, so your decision to reveal your cards now will be based on whether you are a hard-nosed business woman, or a mother who would be deeply upset if her child (student) felt they had had the wool pulled over their eyes by a Landlord.

It will come as no surprise to those who know PlanB to hear this, but I would go straight round to the house to remove my child (student) and would threaten you with all sorts of legal shenanigans. What I'm trying to say is that you may think you can gauge the reaction of the students, but in reality you may be faced with irate parents, especially if they're the ones who are paying/subsidizing the rent.

[Luca]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Hello
My first thought is so what, but it is a long time since I was a student and we were not treated well. What is the student market like where you live, is it in short supply, how does your rent compare to others all these points need to be thought about.
Of course if push comes to shove you can tell the parents to shove off as the tenancy is with their little delicate flowers and as such you have no need to deal with them.

To be fair though and having said all that I think you should tell them that the land is up for sale, in real terms what difference will it make to them....it is nearly autumn and by the spring they should be so busy with exams they won't have time to be in the garden.

[PlanB]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Of course if push comes to shove you can tell the parents to shove off as the tenancy is with their little delicate flowers and as such you have no need to deal with them.

More often than not parents have to act as the guarantor on student tenancy agreements since the Tenant (i.e. the student) is not in employment so has no income of their own to pay the rent. A student loan won't satisfy a reference for a Landlord because these can be withdrawn if the student doesn't keep up with their studies. This means the parent (as guarantor) is effectively the legal entity on the AST. This may also give them the right to raise any issues with breaches of contract.

Unless these tenants are trustafarians of course

[PriorityOne]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

To be honest Miss Daffodil, I would tell the students what your plans are and go from there. Chances are, this will be their last year renting from you anyway as most students return back home after uni.

My daughter has just left uni. after renting a flat for 2 years and I suspect the worst you'll get asked for is a reduction in rent which in all honesty, is only fair if you're taking away part of the facilities they've been paying for. The only time I would have got involved is if her landlord had been unreasonable.

[Miss Daffodil]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Thank you very much for your replies - veryhelpful.

I'm a bit of a soft landlord who will help my tenants whenever I can. (as of yet, none of them in my opinion, as ever taken advantage of this) So, what are your thoughts if I offer compensation straight away ?

All of the students have guarantors which are their parents andthe last thing I want is to get into an argument or worse a legal battle!!!!

The students are in their 3rd and final year tenancy agreement running from 1st September - 31st July 2014.

Kind regards

[Deepie]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Thank you very much for your replies - veryhelpful.

I'm a bit of a soft landlord who will help my tenants whenever I can. (as of yet, none of them in my opinion, as ever taken advantage of this) So, what are your thoughts if I offer compensation straight away ?

All of the students have guarantors which are their parents andthe last thing I want is to get into an argument or worse a legal battle!!!!

The students are in their 3rd and final year tenancy agreement running from 1st September - 31st July 2014.

Kind regards

If the land takes 3/6 months to sell....pointless offering compo straight away ...I would wait until the land sells.....

[PlanB]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

I'm a bit of a soft landlord who will help my tenantswhenever I can. (as of yet, none of them in my opinion, as ever takenadvantage of this) So, what are your thoughts if I offer compensation straight away ?

All of the students have guarantors which are their parents andthe last thing I want is to get into an argument or worse a legal battle!!!!

The students are in their 3rd and final year tenancy agreement running from 1st September - 31st July 2014

That sounds like a plan.

Do you have an idea of the timescale for this change because the compensation needn't kick in until the garden vanishes? The plot may have planning permission but there's a lot more to be done before the bulldozer arrives to start digging the foundations. The purchaser will have to get a Works Specification drawn up, contractors' tenders submitted, Buildings Regulation approval and you haven't even sold it yet with all the legal conveyancing stuff which has to happen. I'd be surprised if the work will start before next spring (digging foundations in the winter is not ideal).

When it comes to compensation I always think tenants like the word FREE. Do the maths and then offer them one or two month's rent free at the end of the tenancy. I suggest that because most students spend their student loan the minute it arrives (my daughter was straight to ASOS online when hers arrived) and money could be tight towards the end of their stay. Whatever you decide you would have to amend the tenancy agreement to reflect the change because it's a legal contract.

[PlanB]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

If the land takes 3/6 months to sell....pointless offering compo straight away ...I would wait until the land sells.....

I agree with that. And since it's the students final year they will probably bugger off after their exams finish at the end of May despite the AST end date being July, so this may not become an issue at all.

[Miss Daffodil]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Thank you very much for your replies. I will let you know the out come.

Kind regards.

[Miss Daffodil]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

If the land takes 3/6 months to sell....pointless offering compo straight away ...I would wait until the land sells.....

Yesterday I had an offer for the plot.

Under asking price, So I've declined the offer for now.

Kind regards.

[Miss Daffodil]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

Another offer this morning, He's upped it by 7k. Still 13k below asking price.

My gut feeling is to hold back.

Kind regards.

[Luca]

Re: Tenancy Agreement Advice

All depends on you desire/need to sell combined with the accuracy of the asking price.