Roger UE Diary

[Roger]

Re: Roger UE Diary

When was the CCJ granted? Exact date?

17 Dec 2014
I settled 21 Dec 2014 some £4,600 they never told the Court and hence left me with CCJ 2 weeks later.
The judge added interest BUT not their Costs nearly £4,000 (which they had bumped up by a further £2000 counsel Fee). The whole could have been nearly £9000

[PlanB]

Re: Roger UE Diary

When was the CCJ granted? Exact date?

Approximate date December 2014 (one year ago).

HSBC
Type of account : Credit Card
Date commenced : Aug 1976
Approx balance : £3,800
Date last paid : May 2012

CCJ Dec 2014

The OP would need to make an application to appeal 'out of time'.

Roger, do you have a copy of your Defence and Counterclaim which you can email to Niddy?

If you raised a legal argument in your Defence which the DJ ignored or 'misjudged' on a point of law then we need to know in order to help you.

So email Niddy your Defence, Counterclaim and Witness Statement and also the Claimant's Claim (N1), POC, and Witness Statement and evidence provided to the court.

Plan B x

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Roger UE Diary

17 Dec 2014
I settled 21 Dec 2014 some £4,600 they never acknowledged this and hence left me with CCJ 2 weeks later.
The judge added interest BUT not their Costs nearly £4,000 (which they had bumped up by a further £2000 counsel Fee). The whole could have been nearly £9000

If you settled it after 4 days there is no CCJ. You get 28 days to pay and if so it is purged. Even leaving it 2 weeks is only 18 days. Ten short.....

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Roger UE Diary

If you raised a legal argument in your Defence which the DJ ignored or 'misjudged' on a point of law..

That allows for an application (appeal) that's out of time

[Roger]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

Which is correct process, as per the regulations (Copy Docs Reg.9) - however the problem occurs with how the cards were incepted. If they just sent you the new credit cards then that changed everything as the relevant sections of CCA were enacted in the late 90's (ie s.60/61/78/87/88 etc etc)....

Likewise, it began as Access (restricted) and went to Visa & MasterCard which was widely accepted (Access wasn't and you couldn't withdraw cash either (from ATM)).

Exactly what happened! They simply sent out HSBC card with updated Credit Limit!! The Personal Loan was because I cleared this right down (big chunk of money) off my head (but I can check the dates 2005/7?

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

Exactly what happened! They simply sent out HSBC card with updated Credit Limit!! The Personal Loan was because I cleared this right down (big chunk of money) off my head (but I can check the dates 2005/7?

Mention this case when you chat to Jo - just remind her it's separate and say Niddy suggested you mention it and ask about the CCJ itself (it shouldn't be valid if settled within 28 days) and also about the access card to midland bank visa/master card "upgrade" when you never asked for a midland bank CREDIT CARD.

[PlanB]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

They simply sent out HSBC card with updated Credit Limit!! The Personal Loan was because I cleared this right down (big chunk of money) off my head (but I can check the dates 2005/7?

Did you raise this legal argument in your Defence?

If you didn't then I doubt you'll be allowed a second bite of the cherry.

A DJ can only be expected to consider the facts put before him at the time (Claim(POC)/Defence/WSs/oral evidence at the hearing).

Send your Defence to Niddy and we'll see where this leads.

Plan B x

[Roger]

Re: Roger UE Diary

That allows for an application (appeal) that's out of time

Well I can send by Defence and Counterclaim over. The Counterclaim was naff but my defence I don't think was. The Court didn't like it so I had to rewrite the Defence.
The original Defence was

The defendant puts the claimant to strict proof of each and every fact pleaded in their particulars of claim.
The claimant response to defendant’s request for copies of this alleged agreement . a) 16^th December 2013 (“the credit card was opened in 1976 and as our client is not required to keep documents that are older that 6 years, they no longer hold a copy”)
b) 7^th January 2014 (“We understand that until we do this we may be unable to take action in the courts”)
The first reference to a 1976 date was (a) above.
The Consumer Credit Act 1974 came into force on 31^st July 1974.
However different sections of the Act were phased in over a number of years & under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Commencement No.2) Order 1977, credit agreements made before 1^st April 1977 were not regulated agreements under the Act.
The claimants alleged agreement dated 1^st August 1976 does not come under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.
The defendant recalls signing no such document.
I was forced by the court to change this or loose by default!
I will dig out the more lengthly amended Defence

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Roger UE Diary

I've just made Jo aware so remind her tmw when you chat.

[Roger]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

Did you raise this legal argument in your Defence?

If you didn't then I doubt you'll be allowed a second bite of the cherry.

A DJ can only be expected to consider the facts put before him at the time (Claim(POC)/Defence/WSs/oral evidence at the hearing).

Send your Defence to Niddy and we'll see where this leads.

Plan B x

I told the Judge! That HSBC had simply sent me their Card (I actually have a early statement that's shows a really low limit - see the Access limit was originally £100 and this remained for the duration) when the switched the Cards that limited began to climb! I will email info over and let you sniff around
I was honest with the Judge! But failed to point something in their witness statement that the had looked for the Agreement but the signed agreement wasn't necessary (words to that effect).
The judge told me I should have gone to a solicitor!!
I didn't issue a witness statement just my defence and counterclaim with evidential docs.
The Judge really gave them a Hollow victory because their Costs were unpaid and more or less equal to the debt + interest.

[Roger]

Re: Roger UE Diary

I've just made Jo aware so remind her tmw when you chat.

Thank you If nothing else at least she will know!

[Roger]

Re: Roger UE Diary

Thank you its seem strange putting the HSBC CC in the Diary BUT this was part of the original plan agreed with ALL my Unsecured Creditors. Hence putting the saga in the Diary and telling the story. If nothing else it helps others especially with these pre 1977 Cards (and they and their predecessors are still around!)

[PlanB]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

I told the Judge! That HSBC had simply sent me their Card . . . .

I was honest with the Judge! But failed to point something in their witness statement that the had looked for the Agreement but the signed agreement wasn't necessary .

If you raised it orally at the hearing then get a transcript.

It was the DJ's job to read the Claimant's WS (evidence before the court) not your job to make him read it.

He had to consider all the facts in front of him.

Plan B x

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Roger UE Diary

Thank you its seem strange putting the HSBC CC in the Diary BUT this was part of the original plan agreed with ALL my Unsecured Creditors. Hence putting the saga in the Diary and telling the story. If nothing else it helps others especially with these pre 1977 Cards (and they and their predecessors are still around!)

1977 is irrelevant - it's May 1985.

Arghhhhhh

Anyway do nothing until Jo suggests best advice

[Roger]

Re: PRA GROUP (UK) LIMITED ( HOWELL JONES LLP ) v Roger - Issued 1 December 2015

If you raised it orally at the hearing then get a transcript.

It was the DJ's job to read the WS (evidence before the court) not your job to make him read it.

He had to consider all the facts in front of him.

Plan B x

She! Yes Plan B! Let me put this lot together scan it and send it over.
HSBC on the very Day of the Case were producing last minute paper works including a further late Witness Statement. Costs escalated and were advised day before! The Original Witness wasn't present to be questioned over their statement.
I was blamed by Counsel for refusing to agree a change of Claim dropping CCA 1974!