Start of my diary

[Roger]

Roger, this is from the last paragraph of the post so it is not I, a layperson, but JCS who is making that distinction

Warwick65 I thank you for your caution and also to not be confrontational with the DCA's a sensible strategy!

Yes I have understood that this a County Court Appeal against the lower District Court decision. BUT there wasn't a High Court Appeal against this County Court judgement was there?

So what is current and relevant for Us is
".. using the unenforceability provisions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 can successfully defend claims for personal Current Account Overdrafts in court ..
.. It was also accepted that Creditors must comply with S 78 Consumer Credit Act 1974 requests relating to personal Current Account Overdrafts, not just credit cards and loans..

This County Court Appeal decision is binding on the lower District Courts (Its the District Courts that we commonly experience in Consumer Credit Cases) This stands as the Law until either the Enacted Law IS Changed by Parliament or somebody RISKS an Appeal TO the High Court (the costs at this level are horrendous)

For the present this is binding on the District Courts!
However I would reiterate ".. Case Law ARGUMENTS ARE BEST LEFT TO LAWYERS NOT US LAY PEOPLE TO ARGUE OVER! .."
It also seems that ARROW would like to confuse you or otherwise by supply some statements etc.. followed by a that rather wishy washy ".. Please note that the product of your account is an overdraft, therefore the copy of agreement is not suitable .."
Well until or unless the DCA's care to risk (and they could lose millions ) a High Court Appeal on that specific point then the County Court Appeal judgement stands as the Law

So my own suggestion!
With AAD silence is the best course to follow from a CCA request! Don't engage in ANY correspondence with Arrow
Wait and see what they send next! Then refer back to AAD

[Warwick65]

Roger, this is from the last paragraph of the post so it is not I, a layperson, but JCS who is making that distinction

. however this decision is not a binding decision on other courts as HHJ Walden-Smith was sitting as a Circuit Judge and not as a High Court Judge.

[Roger]

It was the Court of Appeal and these Cases are binding on the lower courts in matters of Law.
Like so many Case Law arguments these are best left to Lawyers NOT us lay people to argue over!

The importance here is Arrow have sent something, which implies they DO BELIEVE that they are required to respond to your S.77/78 CCA Request!
.. Please note that the product of your account is an overdraft, therefore the copy of agreement is not suitable"..
The NOT SUITABLE is their Opinion! They are not a Court and certainly not the Court Of Appeal

With AAD silence is the best course to follow from a CCA request! Don't engage in ANY correspondence with Arrow
Wait and see what they send next! Then refer back to AAD

[Warwick65]

You might want to read the whole original post. It goes on to say this is not a binding ruling. Wouldn’t want you to go in all guns blazing with only half the story.

[Strepsi]

Originally posted by Joanna Connolly View Post
The claim against our clients in this case was for monies owing under a personal Current Account Overdraft. We lost at first instance before a District Judge in Peterborough County Court and appealed the decision before HHJ Walden-Smith sitting at Cambridge County Court.

The Appeal was successful yesterday. This is an important case because it confirms that consumers using the unenforceability provisions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 can successfully defend claims for personal Current Account Overdrafts in court. In this instant case the Appeal court found the personal Current Account Overdraft agreement to be unenforceable pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act because of lack of evidence of compliance with the requirements of the OFT determination.

It was also accepted that Creditors must comply with S 78 Consumer Credit Act 1974 requests relating to personal Current Account Overdrafts, not just credit cards and loans. In this case the Appeal court did find that MFS Portfolio Ltd had complied with the S 78 Consumer Credit Act request. If they hadn’t complied with the statutory request then the personal Current Account Overdraft would have been unenforceable pursuant to s.78 (6) (a) Consumer Credit Act , which is contrary to the position creditors normally take.

What would be the best course of action?

How would I ask for further information?

At the moment haven't received any further correspondence from Drydens.

[Timewilltell]

I just wrote back to them asking if there was any further paperwork to be forwarded as they haven’t fulfilled the cca request. After a couple of silly reply letters they faded into the sunset.
??

[Roger]

Just come back from a week away.
Received letter from Arrow in that time, it reads...
"We note that from your account that provided you with statements and a copy of terms and conditions in October 2018.
Please note that the product of your account is an overdraft, therefore the copy of agreement is not suitable"
Thoughts please, my thought is that they are incorrect.

Originally posted by Joanna Connolly View Post
The claim against our clients in this case was for monies owing under a personal Current Account Overdraft. We lost at first instance before a District Judge in Peterborough County Court and appealed the decision before HHJ Walden-Smith sitting at Cambridge County Court.

The Appeal was successful yesterday. This is an important case because it confirms that consumers using the unenforceability provisions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 can successfully defend claims for personal Current Account Overdrafts in court. In this instant case the Appeal court found the personal Current Account Overdraft agreement to be unenforceable pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act because of lack of evidence of compliance with the requirements of the OFT determination.

It was also accepted that Creditors must comply with S 78 Consumer Credit Act 1974 requests relating to personal Current Account Overdrafts, not just credit cards and loans. In this case the Appeal court did find that MFS Portfolio Ltd had complied with the S 78 Consumer Credit Act request. If they hadn’t complied with the statutory request then the personal Current Account Overdraft would have been unenforceable pursuant to s.78 (6) (a) Consumer Credit Act , which is contrary to the position creditors normally take.

[stuckinarut]

Just come back from a week away.

Received letter from Arrow in that time, it reads...

"We note that from your account that provided you with statements and a copy of terms and conditions in October 2018.

Please note that the product of your account is an overdraft, therefore the copy of agreement is not suitable"

Thoughts please, my thought is that they are incorrect.

Hi Strepsi Well it wont be suitable for them, Thats for sure. However the cca request worked well for me. Stopped them in their tracks. Pretty sure others will agree. To date file ignore. Take care

[Strepsi]

I have taken your advice, both requests are in enveloples ready to be sent tomorrow along with postal orders. One to Drydens and one to Arrow.

We will see how we get on.

Just come back from a week away.

Received letter from Arrow in that time, it reads...

"We note that from your account that provided you with statements and a copy of terms and conditions in October 2018.

Please note that the product of your account is an overdraft, therefore the copy of agreement is not suitable"

Thoughts please, my thought is that they are incorrect.

[Roger]

DCA's haunt the Credit Reports!
These are a pool of information for interested parties.
Lenders, MOB Providers, DCA's
So be prudent about what details or otherwise you place on these sites!

[Strepsi]

Just my opinion but when you get a CC it shows on your credit file. Creditors may see it as a sign you have disposable income so can pay them.

I got my only court claim after I took out my first new CC. Now I have some at good interest rates or with decent benefits e.g Virgin at 9.9% and Sainsbury with nectar points.

Hi,

I currently have a court claim at the moment. There is one that I have asked for more information that has gone to Arrow/Drydens. So waiting on that.

The other debts that I/we have don't look close to getting to be a threat with court claims, their level of threat hasn't increased for a while.

Our SB month will be the end of Feb, to be on the safe side.

I mention to my wife it is good to keep our head down, but she has got to the point (I am too) where we need something incase of emergency.

That being said, we won't have great deal of choice with CC as we took a card out with every major provider about 8 years ago!!!

[Warwick65]

Just my opinion but when you get a CC it shows on your credit file. Creditors may see it as a sign you have disposable income so can pay them.

I got my only court claim after I took out my first new CC. Now I have some at good interest rates or with decent benefits e.g Virgin at 9.9% and Sainsbury with nectar points.

[Strepsi]

Just a general question.

My wife is considering applying for a CC, only to be used in emergency.

I read somewhere that it isn't a good idea whilst aiming for SB'd.

Is this the case, if it is why?

[Strepsi]

Hi again,

I have received your email. I'll review the Particulars of Claim and come back to you.

I have now got Joanna Connolly Solicitors working for me (again).

In safe hands...

[Colin G Quinn]

Hi again,

I have received your email. I'll review the Particulars of Claim and come back to you.