The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Quick update - doorstep threat from Apex so have sent them a combined letter using both templates also referring back to the fact their client has ignored previous correspondence (lot more letters sent to BLS collections prior to 26/7/2012.

SnV

Good luck mate

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Lloyds TSB:

• Type of account - Current Account/Overdraft
  
  
• Date commenced - Early/Mid 2007 (not sure exactly)
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £800
  
  
• Date last full payment - August 2010?
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Arrangement (stopped DMP payments July 2012)
  
  
• Status - Default notice received
  
  
• Account owner - Collection with Apex Credit Management (still owned by Lloyds TSB)
  

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

26/7/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. One liner stating that I must contact them TODAY

1/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. I appear to be in arrears on my payment arrangement. Unless I bring my arrangement back on track within 10 days they may take further action to collect the full balance.

7/8/2012 - Sent OD CCA Request - allaboutFORUMS - View Single Post - Overdrafts - CCA Information

16/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS stating that while they control account no interest will be accruing
16/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS stating that if I wish to make a payment then could I please contact them by phone
24/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. One liner stating that I must contact them TODAY
17/10/2012 - Notice from Lloyds TSB that account has transferred to Apex Credit Management Limited for collection
17/10/2012 - Introduction letter from Apex Credit Management
3/1/2013 - Letter from HL Solicitors threatening legal action
28/1/2013 - Letter from Apex Credit Management
4/2/2013 - Home Visit Appointment letter from Apex Credit Management
4/2/2013 - Sent OD CCA Request - allaboutFORUMS - View Single Post - Overdrafts - CCA Information combined with doorstep letter template

Quick update - doorstep threat from Apex so have sent them a combined letter using both templates also referring back to the fact their client has ignored previous correspondence (lot more letters sent to BLS collections prior to 26/7/2012.

SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Lloyds TSB:

• Type of account - Current Account/Overdraft
  
  
• Date commenced - Early/Mid 2007 (not sure exactly)
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £800
  
  
• Date last full payment - August 2010?
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Arrangement (stopped DMP payments July 2012)
  
  
• Status - Default notice received
  
  
• Account owner - Collection with Apex Credit Management (still owned by Lloyds TSB)
  

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

26/7/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. One liner stating that I must contact them TODAY

1/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. I appear to be in arrears on my payment arrangement. Unless I bring my arrangement back on track within 10 days they may take further action to collect the full balance.

7/8/2012 - Sent OD CCA Request - allaboutFORUMS - View Single Post - Overdrafts - CCA Information

16/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS stating that while they control account no interest will be accruing
16/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS stating that if I wish to make a payment then could I please contact them by phone
24/8/2012 - Letter received from BLS Collections. One liner stating that I must contact them TODAY
17/10/2012 - Notice from Lloyds TSB that account has transferred to Apex Credit Management Limited for collection
17/10/2012 - Introduction letter from Apex Credit Management
3/1/2013 - Letter from HL Solicitors threatening legal action
28/1/2013 - Letter from Apex Credit Management

Letter from Apex Credit Management contents as follows:

Our client has requested we contact you to arrange payment of the full outstanding balance.

We have made enquiries and sources have shown that you are resident at the address on this letter. Our clients have advised that previous attempts to contact you have been unsuccessful and this is potentially your last opportunity to arrange payment before further action will be considered.

Our staff are fully trained to assist you with your current situation and have a range of options to help. If you are unable to pay and are experiencing financial difficulty we strongly recommend that you call us to discuss repayment of your balance.

To prevent this matter becoming unmanageable please contact our offices within 10 days from the date of this letter.

So you have to love the weasel words. I also like the fact that this letter was dated the 18th Jan and has obviously been posted so late that they knew it would be delivered outside of their '10 day' deadline.

I'm going to send a letter to these clowns enclosing the O/D CCA request I sent back in August with proof of the delivery as it was sent RD. I'll ask them to explain why it is their client have not responded to my reasonable request, and why they claim to have not received correspondence when they quite clearly have.

Also going to look at a SAR to dispute the charges placed on this account (I think O/D was only something like £300, rest is charges).

Best
SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Halifax/IF:

• Type of account - Credit Card
  
  
• Date commenced - Years and years ago!
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £800
  
  
• Date last full payment - Unknown
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Not paying (already established UE)
  
  
• Status - Defaulted though no DN received
  
  
• Account owner - Capquest
  

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

2/5/2012 - CCA Request Sent
7/6/2012 - Letter from Halifax/If stating that they cannot find my credit agreement and will not try to enforce the agreement while they try to find it
June 2012 - Numerous letters from Wescot making threats
2/7/2012 - Letter to Wescot - Account Sold While In Dispute
7/10/2012 - Letter from Halifax/If stating account transferred to Capquest
19/10/2012 11:05 - Telephone call from Capquest
25/10/2012 - Introduction letter from Capquest
26/10/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Account Sold While In Dispute
26/10/2012 08:50 - Telephone call from Capquest
29/10/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Telephone harassment at work letter
2/11/2012 - Letter from Capquest asking for £1 for CCA request!
13/11/2012 14:38 - Telephone call from Capquest
17/11/2012 - Threat-O-Gram from Capquest
21/11/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Our Templates | Unenforceability Templates | Final Response - Unenforceability (No CCA Received)
1/12/2012 - Letter from Howard Cohen Solicitors stating that court action may be taken
10/12/2012 - Another Letter to Capquest - Our Templates | Unenforceability Templates | Final Response - Unenforceability (No CCA Received)
17/12/2012 - Letter from Capquest acknowledging complaint and stating account is on hold
17/12/2012 - Letter from Capquest offering reduced settlement figure
5/1/2013 - Letter from Capquest responding to complaint
23/1/2013 - Letter from IF rejecting complaint

Hi All

So today get the following letter from IF in response to my Final Response letter to Capquest. Content as follows:

Dear Mr SnV

Thank you for taking the time to contact us about your complaint. I am concerned to hear about the problem you've had with your Intelligent Finance credit card. Please accept my apologies for the inconvenience and upset that we've caused you.

My understanding of your complaint is:

1) You're unhappy we've not provided you with a true copy of your signed credit agreement

2) As a result you don't feel the agreement is enforceable

I've fully reviewed your complaint and I'm now in a position to explain my findings to you.

As we confirmed in our letter dated xx/xxx/2012 our procedure is, and always has been, to obtain a customers signature to an agreement that detail the relevant terms and conditions relating to the credit card before entering into a credit card agreement.

Even if the agreement is not enforceable, it is clear from case law, this only prevents one party from enforcing the agreement through the courts; it does not prevent collections activity or the placing of information on the credit file.

As such repayment of the outstanding balance on your credit card will still be required. Please contact the debt management company, Capquest, on 08700843501 to arrange a payment plan.

I hope I've explained why I believe we haven't made a mistake. I appreciate that my decision may not be the one you wished for, but I hope you understand the reasons for it.

Theres some stuff then about contacting the FOS blah blah if I'm still unhappy with their decision.

So although they say it was always their procedure to obtain a signature there is still no acknowledgement that this procedure may not have been followed as has also been demonstrated in recent case law!

They also still admit that if the agreement is not enforceable (which it is not) that the only thing they can do is continue 'collection activity' and mark my credit file (which they already have).

So what bets that I am going to contact Capquest?

I'll wait and see what the Capquest threat-o-gram churns out next and see if it makes any reference to court action, in which case I'll send another complaint letter as their client admits in their letter above that such action cannot be taken!

Best
SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Littlewoods (Shop Direct):

• Type of account - Catalogue Account
  
  
• Date commenced - Early/Mid 2007 (not sure exactly)
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £750
  
  
• Date last full payment - August 2010?
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Arrangement (stopped DMP payments July 2012)
  
  
• Status - Default notice received
  
  
• Account owner - Lowell

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

13/8/2012 - Letter received from Lowell asking what they can do to help
21/8/2012 - Payment break letter sent
13/8/2012 - Letter received from Lowell demanding payment in full or £30 a month
3/9/2012 - Letter from Lowell suspending collection
2/11/2012 - Letter from Lowell asking me to contact them to make a payment arrangement
15/11/2012 - Letter from Lowell demanding payment in full
11/12/2012 - Letter from Lowell threatening doorstep collection or possible court action
17/12/2012 - CCA Request sent
17/12/2012 - Made payment to bring balance under £750
3/1/2013 - Letter from Lowell confirming CCA request received and waiting on documents from Littlewoods
10/1/2013 - Letter from Lowell stating CCA being looked for and demanding full payment
17/1/2012 - Letter from Lowell - still looking for the CCA

Quick update - SDG still trying to retrieve a CCA from their archives.......

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Littlewoods (Shop Direct):

• Type of account - Catalogue Account
  
  
• Date commenced - Early/Mid 2007 (not sure exactly)
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £750
  
  
• Date last full payment - August 2010?
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Arrangement (stopped DMP payments July 2012)
  
  
• Status - Default notice received
  
  
• Account owner - Lowell

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

13/8/2012 - Letter received from Lowell asking what they can do to help
21/8/2012 - Payment break letter sent
13/8/2012 - Letter received from Lowell demanding payment in full or £30 a month
3/9/2012 - Letter from Lowell suspending collection
2/11/2012 - Letter from Lowell asking me to contact them to make a payment arrangement
15/11/2012 - Letter from Lowell demanding payment in full
11/12/2012 - Letter from Lowell threatening doorstep collection or possible court action
17/12/2012 - CCA Request sent
17/12/2012 - Made payment to bring balance under £750
3/1/2013 - Letter from Lowell confirming CCA request received and waiting on documents from Littlewoods
10/1/2013 - Letter from Lowell stating CCA being looked for and demanding full payment

Letter from Lowells yesterday. SDG are looking for my agreement 'from their archives' and they state that once they provide me with the CCA they will be demanding payment in full.

Well they can demand what they want they will not be getting it.

At the very least, even if its not UE, I doubt very much that the agreement allows provision for them to be able to apply a charge just because they could not contact me by telephone. So I will be disputing the account based on unreasonable charges.

Lowell could be chasing both a UE debt and one based on unreasonable charges very shortly!

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

LOL well without wanting to draw the attention of the evil eye Lowells have another 4 SDG accounts which have all strangely gone quiet over the last few months after receiving CCA requests

Mate they know, as well as we know, that they made a huge error in just sending goods then a little flyer 4-6 weeks later purporting to be a CCA!

Anyway, I'd not worry too much.

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Haha they can't find it cos it doesn't exist but sod settling. Tell em to take you to court without any agreement...! See if they take the bait

LOL well without wanting to draw the attention of the evil eye Lowells have another 4 SDG accounts which have all strangely gone quiet over the last few months after receiving CCA requests

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Hiya

Got a response from Lowell that account is on hold while they find the agreement so don't worry theres a loooong way to go yet

Best
SnV

Haha they can't find it cos it doesn't exist but sod settling. Tell em to take you to court without any agreement...! See if they take the bait

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Hi Niddy

Yes it went to BLS Collections, but they ignored it. I'll resend to Apex and see what response I get from them.

Cheers
SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Why settle mate? It's SDG - they don't do agreements. They'll never go legal, the risk is too great based on Mayhew judgment with Santander.

SDG have never obtained judgment yet.

Hiya

Got a response from Lowell that account is on hold while they find the agreement so don't worry theres a loooong way to go yet

Best
SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

have you sent an OD CCA?

--> Overdrafts - CCA Information - allaboutFORUMS

Hi Niddy

Yes it went to BLS Collections, but they ignored it. I'll resend to Apex and see what response I get from them.

Cheers
SnV

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Halifax/IF:

• Type of account - Credit Card
  
  
• Date commenced - Years and years ago!
  
  
• Approx balance - Approx £800
  
  
• Date last full payment - Unknown
  
  
• Are you on arrangement or not paying - Not paying (already established UE)
  
  
• Status - Defaulted though no DN received
  
  
• Account owner - Capquest
  

Key:
Blue - Communication Sent
Red - Communication Received

2/5/2012 - CCA Request Sent
7/6/2012 - Letter from Halifax/If stating that they cannot find my credit agreement and will not try to enforce the agreement while they try to find it
June 2012 - Numerous letters from Wescot making threats
2/7/2012 - Letter to Wescot - Account Sold While In Dispute
7/10/2012 - Letter from Halifax/If stating account transferred to Capquest
19/10/2012 11:05 - Telephone call from Capquest
25/10/2012 - Introduction letter from Capquest
26/10/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Account Sold While In Dispute
26/10/2012 08:50 - Telephone call from Capquest
29/10/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Telephone harassment at work letter
2/11/2012 - Letter from Capquest asking for £1 for CCA request!
13/11/2012 14:38 - Telephone call from Capquest
17/11/2012 - Threat-O-Gram from Capquest
21/11/2012 - Letter to Capquest - Our Templates | Unenforceability Templates | Final Response - Unenforceability (No CCA Received)
1/12/2012 - Letter from Howard Cohen Solicitors stating that court action may be taken
10/12/2012 - Another Letter to Capquest - Our Templates | Unenforceability Templates | Final Response - Unenforceability (No CCA Received)
17/12/2012 - Letter from Capquest acknowledging complaint and stating account is on hold
17/12/2012 - Letter from Capquest offering reduced settlement figure
5/1/2013 - Letter from Capquest responding to complaint

Got the following letter from Capquest today. Looks like they are going to try to wash their hands of the account

Dear Mr SnV

Capquest were instructed by HBOS pls to contact you regarding an outstanding balance of £xxx.xx. Please be assured, it is always Capquests aim and intention to resolve matters swiftly and amicably and I can assure you that I have conducted a thorough investigation on your account.

We acknowledge the comments made within your letter in respect to the enforceability of the debt, due to the copy agreement you have previously received from HBOS plc. Having investigated the account, we can confirm that we are unable to comment on actions or documents provided by HBOS plc prior to our involvement.

However to assist you further we have placed your account on hold for 30 days and forwarded a copy of your letter to HBOS plc for their comments.

Upon receiving a response we will be in further contact with you at the earliest convenience.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

I have the following letter today from HL Solicitors. Considering I have had no communication from their client other than an introduction letter I think the O/D CCA letter to Apex needs to be sent as their client seem to have completely ignored it.

I also have the complaint that the majority of the balance is also made up of charges so I think a charge reclaim should be a line of attack also.

Letter from HL Legal as follows:

Notice of Pending Legal Action

We have been instructed by Apex Credit Management, agents for the above named creditor, in relation to your outstanding account in the sum of £xxx.xx

Unless our client receives payment in full or a valid reason for non payment of the account within the next 7 days then court proceedings may be taken against you without further notice.

Should court proceedings be issued, you may be liable for court fees, solicitors costs, and interest which may make it difficult for you to obtain credit in the future.

If you wish to avoid this course of action from being taken against you then you must telephone our client on 0845 849 8920 and one of their advisors will discuss this matter with you.

Please note we are instructed not to enter into correspondence with you at this stage but refer you to Apex Credit Management. You can contact them by the number stated above or at the address supplied on previous correspondence.

have you sent an OD CCA?

--> Overdrafts - CCA Information - allaboutFORUMS

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: The SaltnVinegar UE Diary

Thanks Vint

Very true - strangely though Lowells have not added any charges of their own - the balance has remained the same since they took on the account.

I am going to challenge the charges that SD applied to the account (makes up over half of the balance) too.

If it comes back not UE my goal is F&F on this account.

I'm following Pauls ethos on his blog with this account so will see how Lowells react.....

SnV

Why settle mate? It's SDG - they don't do agreements. They'll never go legal, the risk is too great based on Mayhew judgment with Santander.

SDG have never obtained judgment yet.