Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

[PlanB]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

As per the Judge's directions notice . . . . . We sent details of properties owned, including jointly owned, copies of business partnership accounts, business bank statements, copies of share certificates and valuations, copy of son's mortgage application, son's personal bank statements. The partnership accounts include details of my drawing, my capital account, my tax payments. This is a private partnership.

. . . I cannot believe that this should happen. By the end of the week, half the town will know not only my son's income and current financial position, but they will also know my earnings and what is in the business account.

Surely this cannot be right?

I'm afraid it is right.

The Tribunal issued directions seeking full disclosure of your son's financial affairs. Your son is a partner in the family business. The Tribunal is not seeking information about you, it's seeking information about your business which happens to be jointly owned by your son. They are also seeking information about properties and assets that he has which are also jointly owned by you. It's not personal.

[PlanB]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

We appealed this case against CSA figures. At tribunal son was listed as the appellant, mum no3 as the respondent. The judge decided to change the case, she has listed the next session as mum no3 as the appellant and my son and mum no1 as the respondent. Mum no1 should not even be involved, judge told csa to find out her address.
Legal advice if possible. Can a tribunal judge change appellant and respondent?

You need to ask the case worker at the Tribunal to give you the reason for the change if it wasn't made apparent at the hearing. Did Mum 3's lawyers make an application to change things and if so were you notified in advance of the application so you could prepare your response? It's unlikely a Tribunal judge would make a procedural error all by herself, although it has been known.

You say Mum No 1 shouldn't be involved but the Judge may have the discretion to join her into the proceedings whether you, she or your son like it on not.

Like you say you need legal advice. I've previously guided you to a website which provides specific legal advice for fathers in your son's situation.

It's my personal view that you need professional legal advice for the hearing next month, and I also think your son needs legal representation so he doesn't get screwed over by the other side's legal team. This could be a case of 'penny wise pound foolish' especially when your case is so complicated with three different mothers and their three different children, involving legal issues falling under CSA and CMS legislation. You've paid for an accountant to prepare your son's financial statement so it may be wise to pay for legal help at this stage. McKenzie Friends are much cheaper than lawyers too.

[cymruambyth]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

I have sent out an SOS for you, but I don't know if anyone has specific knowledge on this.

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Really need help on this one. We appealed this case against CSA figures. At tribunal son was listed as the appellant, mum no3 as the respondent. The judge decided to change the case, she has listed the next session as mum no3 as the appellant and my son and mum no1 as the respondent. Mum no1 should not even be involved, judge told csa to find out her address.
Legal advice if possible. Can a tribunal judge change appellant and respondent?
Could do with some input, quickly.
Thanks

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Just a question. Hope someone will know the answer to this. As per the Judge's directions notice, I asked our accountants to deal with the financial requirements. We sent details of properties owned, including jointly owned, copies of business partnership accounts, business bank statements, copies of share certificates and valuations, copy of son's mortgage application, son's personal bank statements. The partnership accounts include details of my drawing, my capital account, my tax payments. This is a private partnership. The court have sent full copies of this information to Mother no 1, as she was still getting CSA money from my son for 3 weeks after Mother no 3 put in her application. All of the financial information has also been sent to Mother no 3. I cannot believe that this should happen. By the end of the week, half the town will know not only my son's income and current financial position, but they will also know my earnings and what is in the business account.
Surely this cannot be right?

[PlanB]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Now found case law on self employed partner. Appeal no. CCS/3334/2013 In the upper tribunal. Just what is needed.

That's good news. See if you can find three examples so you don't leave the Tribunal with any wiggle room.

There's one here for offsetting company losses etc. This website has loads of Tribunal Decisions including those which went all the way to the Supreme Court which can't be ignored by the Judge:

.http://www.osscsc.gov.uk/Aspx/view.aspx?id=4259

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Now found case law on self employed partner. Appeal no. CCS/3334/2013 In the upper tribunal. Just what is needed.

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

My son is convinced that he is the dad, all he wants is for child maintenance service team to accept that his payments should now be for 2 children. I want the assessment done properly as a self - employed partner. Not on HMRC figures. Will keep you updated.

[PlanB]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

I agree with you Sapphy.

This man in yesterday's Daily Mirror has paid £31k in Child Support over 23 years and only just had a Paternity Test done where he discovered he's not the father. The CSA won't refund him the money either

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...-child-4074479

[Pixie]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Not going to shoot you Sappy...it's a very valid point.

[Sapphire]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Sounds about right, didn't want him to be the father, but sure enough wants him to be the benefactor, seriously hun, get a DNA test done, it sounds to me that she's pulling all the strings, its about time you fought back and dirty. I know your convinced that the child is his, but what if it isn't eh, there's so many men out there paying out for kids that are not their own, through no fault of their own.

Right..... go on then, shoot me for that one everyone, but there are unscrupulous girls out there arn't there.

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

On another point, my Son did not decide to turn his back on his child. Mother number 3 refused to put his name on the birth certificate, she has already stated that he has NO parental rights.

[Enforcer]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Yes we wanted child no 3 on the new scheme, so that they would now assess him as also paying for child no 2, £200 a month family based arrangement. The CSA do not recognise family based arrangements but the new scheme CMS do. (Or should).
They have done exactly the same as CSA and not recognised child no 2. The maintenance figure should now be divided between both children.
In answer to your other questions, yes I am his representative at tribunal, yes my business will be picking up the bill. My son is a really good hard worker, not very good on computers, and does have difficulty writing letters. Simply would not be able to deal with this. Not coping well with the stress.
Thanks for the links.

[PlanB]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Letter today for son from Child Maintenance Appeals Team.

. . . Child no 2 was not recognised by CSA as he had a "family arrangement" of £200 a month. But child no 3 was put onto the old CSA scheme. In order to get child no 2 recognised he had to register with CSA to get moved onto the new CMS scheme. We argued that child no 3 should have been put onto the new scheme and not the old.

CMS have now advised that child no 3 is under the new scheme and they want a payment of £316.75 a month for child no 3. No mention at all of child no 2..

Unless I've misunderstood, you have got what you wanted. Child No 3 is under the new CMS scheme.

What you're not happy about is the sum that the CMS says your son has to pay the mother of his child.

It's not clear from your posts whether you are acting as your son's formal representative with these Tribunal proceedings because he is feeling overwhelmed by all the money and legal stuff, or whether he wants to wash his hands of this problem and leave it to you to deal with everything since it's your business which is picking up the tab. Perhaps he feels that since he's made the decision to turn his back on his child that he no longer has any responsibility in dealing with how the finances are sorted.

Mum 3 has got legal advisors. I think you and your son need legal advice. There's a lot of legal information on this website including factsheets and maintenance case law

http://www.fnf.org.uk/law-and-inform...ld-maintenance

http://www.fnf.org.uk/law-and-inform...er:Maintenance


Families Need Fathers has a lively forum which your son or you can join and exchange information with others in the same situation

http://www.fnf.org.uk/help-and-suppo...e-forum#whatis

[Pixie]

Re: Child Support Agency 2003 scheme Child Maintenance new scheme for cases after 25th Nov 2013

Unfortunately they're just the same (ie incompetent) as many government agencies