SCS & Creation Loan

[PlanB]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

I've just discovered that this story finally had a happy ending after over a year of hassle

the (unreported) HAPPY ending is that I understand Paul got rid of this once and for all.

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

UPDATE - SCS Sofa / Creation Loan - Drydensfairfax Solicitors

I have just received a letter from the Solicitors in response to my email that I sent as a quick 'stop any action'.

I explained that I was ill and that I am in and out of hospital could they bare with me while I having tests and results before I can give them a full response. They have taken that on board and are speaking to their clients (Creation) about it and will get their instruction soon.

After reading my thread and what Paul has been saying I feel that since the Solicitor has no idea what is really going on as they wont have been told the in's and out's of everything, but just that I owe £x amount of money that needs to be paid....

I feel it is important (as Paul says)that they understand the situation better and understand how badly I have been treated. I have all the letters and emails that I have ever sent and received so I can start by sending them a few details out of those before I start with S75 and all of the other legal stuff.

If anyone doesn't agree with me please say so and I can change things around. I just want to be given a chance and not to have any court action happen to me.

I do understand when I have been told that it wouldn't be a bad thing to go to court due to the hassle of everything that has happened but I would rather sort things out and come to some sort of agreement before that happens!

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Thats tricky

I would stress you need to tell the solicitors what the issues are, why you are unhappy with the sofa and what you want from their client.

Its not a simple case of saying Im gonna counterclaim under s75 liability, you need to tell them what is wrong with the sofa as well.

Thank Paul... What would we do without you???

OK. Do you think a letter without any S75, etc in and just an explanation of what is going on with the sofa and why I have not made any payments towards it? Then, wait and see what they send back and hope they do not issue any court papers but instead answer my letter. That would then give me more time and they would at least understand why we are at this stage with the involvement of the solicitors?

OR

Think is best to do a letter using S75 in your post (earlier on in the thread where you have picked a section out) and the OFT guides for the Consumer and what they are expected to do and not to do as highlighter a part of it below?

[B][I]Faulty goods that have been accepted
If the item does not conform to contract (is faulty) for any of the reasons outlined and the customer has accepted the goods, the law says the customer is entitled to claim a repair or replacement of the goods in the first instance.

If either a repair or replacement is not possible, or the cost is greater than the value of the item (disproportionately costly), or the customer claims either option is taking an unreasonable amount of time or is causing unreasonable inconvenience, the customer is then entitled to
keep the goods and claim a price reduction from the retailer to compensate them for the fault in the goods - this would be the difference between the value of the product in perfect condition and the value of the product in the faulty condition, or
return the goods and rescind the contract . This would mean that the customer returns the goods and you provide a partial refund, calculated to reflect the benefit the customer has received from the product.
Where a customer is entitled to repair or replacement because they have accepted the goods, they can claim price reduction or partial refund if the repair or replacement is
taking an unreasonable time, or
causing an unreasonable inconvenience, or
if the repair or replacement is not satisfactory when they receive it.
When you calculate price reductions or partial refunds, think about what an impartial person in a court would think is a reasonable amount.
Proving a problem
Included in the law is a section on burden of proof. This outlines whether you are entitled to ask a customer to prove that an item was faulty when they bought it from you.

The details of the law are explained opposite. If you are considering asking a customer to prove that an item was faulty when they bought it from you, it is important to consider what proof an impartial person in a court might feel was required. For example, someone in a court might accept that a simple customer statement saying that their item did not work correctly would be sufficient proof.

75 Liability of creditor for breaches by supplier.

(1)If the debtor under a debtor-creditor-supplier agreement falling within section 12(b) or © has, in relation to a transaction financed by the agreement, any claim against the supplier in respect of a misrepresentation or breach of contract, he shall have a like claim against the creditor, who, with the supplier, shall accordingly be jointly and severally liable to the debtor.
(2)Subject to any agreement between them, the creditor shall be entitled to be indemnified by the supplier for loss suffered by the creditor in satisfying his liability under subsection (1), including costs reasonably incurred by him in defending proceedings instituted by the debtor.
(3)Subsection (1) does not apply to a claim—
(a)under a non-commercial agreement, F1. . .
(b)so far as the claim relates to any single item to which the supplier has attached a cash price not exceeding [F2£100] or more than [F3£30,000][F4, or]
[F5(c)under a debtor-creditor-supplier agreement for running-account credit—
(i)which provides for the making of payments by the debtor in relation to specified periods which, in the case of an agreement which is not secured on land, do not exceed three months, and
(ii)which requires that the number of payments to be made by the debtor in repayments of the whole amount of the credit provided in each such period shall not exceed one.]

That could be made up to a letter and be more suitable than the one you have posted up for LBA on CC/loans, etc

What do you think?

[Paul.]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Paul,

Could I use the above letter for Creation or is it not suitable? If not I will make a letter from S75.

Thanks

Thats tricky

I would stress you need to tell the solicitors what the issues are, why you are unhappy with the sofa and what you want from their client.

Its not a simple case of saying Im gonna counterclaim under s75 liability, you need to tell them what is wrong with the sofa as well.

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Paul,

Could I use the above letter for Creation or is it not suitable? If not I will make a letter from S75.

Thanks

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

well in that case you need to reply setting out that the matter is disputed and that the creditor is jointly and severably liable for the defective good. Therefore if they were to issue a claim against you, you would have a counterclaim under s75 Consumer Credit Act 1974 against their client

Thank you Paul.

This is very similar to the bespoke letter you did for someone recently that I am also using for MBNA's threat of litigation set out below. Maybe pick bits out?

"Since your letter clearly refers to the threat of litigation, I am treating it as a formal letter of claim albeit an entirely defective one.

I refer you to the Civil Procedure Rules pre action protocol practice direction, in particular Annex A and Annex B, you will note your letter fails spectacularly to comply with either of the aforesaid Annexs.

Since you are a firm of solicitors, i cannot excuse such failures and place you on notice that any litigation on the back of this letter will result in an immediate application to the Court requesting the matter stayed with costs against you and your client on the indemnity basis. I refer you to Para 4.6 of the Practice Direction which explains the consequences of non compliance with the Pre action protocol.

Turning to the subject matter of your letter, this matter is subject of a dispute which has been raised with your clients representatives and therefore it would be appropriate before you threaten litigation for your clients client to actively deal with the issues which i have raised.

The main crux of my dispute is .................................................. ......


Accordingly and in accordance with the CPR pre action protocol practice direction i look forward to your reply setting out correctly the nature of your clients claim and answering my dispute as stated above."

Is this the same kind of letter I could be writing to Creation? Or should I just use what you have said mentioning S75 and issuing a counter claim?

[Paul.]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Creation have issues a default notice upon you under the CCA 1974. Your failure to comply with the notice now results in the termination of your credit agreement as at the date of this letter. Our client therefore demands the sum of £x (nearly 1k over the original amount despite they put on hold several times and was suppose to charge me anything while it was investigated)

Our intention is to obtain a CCJ against you.

well in that case you need to reply setting out that the matter is disputed and that the creditor is jointly and severably liable for the defective good. Therefore if they were to issue a claim against you, you would have a counterclaim under s75 Consumer Credit Act 1974 against their client

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Creation have issues a default notice upon you under the CCA 1974. Your failure to comply with the notice now results in the termination of your credit agreement as at the date of this letter. Our client therefore demands the sum of £x (nearly 1k over the original amount despite they put on hold several times and was suppose to charge me anything while it was investigated)

Our intention is to obtain a CCJ against you.

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

thats the question

Are you still fighting them over the sofa??

or is it now all sorted and you are now needing to pay for the goods?

Just want to clarify where were at here

I am still disputing the goods as they are defective and not the goods I actually wanted or chose! The first sofa I had collapsed and under their own agreement (SCS) section 3.2.4 (or whatever) it says that "any stock can be returned without any further action and agreement of loan cancelled. They wouldn't do that and they ignored everything I said. I even wrote to the top guy there and he ignored me and they said I had to take another sofa. I then while just out of hospital and completely away with the fairies on Morphine and ketamine,to name a few sent a sales man to my home to talk about the sofa and got me to some how sign for another sofa! It was completely different than the first one and wouldn't fit in the room so its been in the garage since they brought it round. I had no other alternative seating so little choice but to accept it. I was told by the manager of the store (3rd one I had dealt with) who also came to my house that if I wasn't happy it could be returned! This was not the case and despite me fighting all this time and Creation trying to contact SCS it has now got to this!

[Paul.]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Sorry Paul,

So basically if I am still arguing the defective goods then I should be writing back saying that the claimants claim is rejected on the basis of S75 which explains that they are both liable for the goods, etc??? Am I on the right road?

thats the question

Are you still fighting them over the sofa??

or is it now all sorted and you are now needing to pay for the goods?

Just want to clarify where were at here

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

Sorry Paul,

So basically if I am still arguing the defective goods then I should be writing back saying that the claimants claim is rejected on the basis of S75 which explains that they are both liable for the goods, etc??? Am I on the right road?

[Paul.]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

"If it is, then its important to consider if the letter complies with the pre action protocol and if not, then the solicitors failings should be outlined to them within any reply."

What is the pre action protocol?

PRACTICE DIRECTION – PRE-ACTION CONDUCT - Civil Procedure Rules

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

"If it is, then its important to consider if the letter complies with the pre action protocol and if not, then the solicitors failings should be outlined to them within any reply."

What is the pre action protocol?

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

This seems to me to be a letter of claim.

If it is, then its important to consider if the letter complies with the pre action protocol and if not, then the solicitors failings should be outlined to them within any reply.

The pre action protocol sets out what you must do, so if you are still disputing the defective goods, then you should reply setting out that the Claimants claim is rejected on the basis of s75 Consumer Credit Act liability.

It is important not to ignore the letter as to do so would open you to costs consequences

I know hence why I am trying to get some idea as to what is the best way to do things.. Are posts crossed at the same time!

You mean them claiming money back? Yes they have said they want the money plus a massive £1k interest to be paid back.

So you mean that me disputing the defective goods I need to reply setting out the Claimants claim is rejected? You mean using all the S75 you wrote down last time?

I want to get a letter off as soon as I can. I did get all the information together and took out the bits of your S75 and Niddy was working with me to do the letter but I haven't heard from him...

Once I get a few ideas and understand it I will be fine I just need to understand what you are saying and put it down in writing to them... (not exactly what you say!)

[Flossy]

Re: SCS & Creation Loan

I hate this one... I am completely brain dead when it comes to Creation... I compiled a lot of bits for a letter and then added the bits I thought where most important in Paul's very long S75 piece that he did and I emailed to Niddy but I haven't heard back. Maybe I should try and make a letter from it myself and see what happens??? If anyone has any advice that will help me please feel free to make any comments...

I just feel like this is such a big, long drawn out thing that a letter (if left to me) will be about 100 pages long. So much has happened with this that its hard to know where to begin, the main content and the ending??? They are now going to be saying that I have had the sofa for x amount of years/months that any damage/ware and tear is inevitable! Creation wont be bothered about the bad service I have had and it being a sofa I didn't pick and was signing agreements at my home when I was off my trolley straight out of hospital! mmmm... Need to make short and sharp, to the point and good end! Help?