P800 Tax Calculation help

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Fab thank you!

I shall speak to her this afternoon and ask about the P46.
Could she ask for a copy of the details of when it was supposedly sent to the HMRC?
Both the P46 if this was done of course, and P45 perhaps? (from the employer)?

If this does resolve, I expect them the repayment would therefore be cancelled on her end??

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Right ok couple of things.

ESC A19 i believe is the reasons which someone does not have to pay an underpayment, for example, if HMRC notices it 6 years later, you could argue they should have spotted it sooner.

HMRC are saying that a) they never received a P45 and a P46 was submitted instead

b) Even though your friend was taxed at 647L X (month 1 week 1) the P14 at the end of the year, submitted by her employer should she was taxed at 647L Cumlative.

Now, this is quite odd since, the payments made by the employer each month to HMRC wouldnt tally with the final P14 figures if this was the case.

The employer would appear to HMRC as either overpaying or underpaying the tax due.

Since its an underpayment it clearly shows the latter being correct.

Now what HMRC have said if you look closely is this.



So they are writing to the employer to see if it was there error and if so, they should pay the underpayment.

If they find that to be the case, your friend will have the extra deductions refunded to her.

Plus they have agreed to spread it over 2 years which i think is pretty fair to be honest.

Your friend should try to recall if she ever signed a P46 declaration, i bet she didnt, they prob filled it in and submitted it online.

Secondly, your friend should maybe reply to HMRC's letter and thank them, say please note, i never signed a P46 and since the employer has stated on the P14 i was tax cumlative when infact i was taxed emergency, can only strengthen the fact that its the employers error thus should pay the underpayment.

Something along those lines.

Fab thank you!

I shall speak to her this afternoon and ask about the P46.
Could she ask for a copy of the details of when it was supposedly sent to the HMRC?
Both the P46 if this was done of course, and P45 perhaps? (from the employer)?

[cymruambyth]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Your friend needs 2 reviews followed by 2 complaints and then she can go to the adjudicator.v

[SXGuy]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Right ok couple of things.

ESC A19 i believe is the reasons which someone does not have to pay an underpayment, for example, if HMRC notices it 6 years later, you could argue they should have spotted it sooner.

HMRC are saying that a) they never received a P45 and a P46 was submitted instead

b) Even though your friend was taxed at 647L X (month 1 week 1) the P14 at the end of the year, submitted by her employer should she was taxed at 647L Cumlative.

Now, this is quite odd since, the payments made by the employer each month to HMRC wouldnt tally with the final P14 figures if this was the case.

The employer would appear to HMRC as either overpaying or underpaying the tax due.

Since its an underpayment it clearly shows the latter being correct.

Now what HMRC have said if you look closely is this.

In certain circumstances we can ask the employer (or pension provider) to pay an underpayment of tax if it results from their error. I will write to employer for their explanation. I will write to you again when I have concluded my enquiries.

I am afraid these enquries can take some time to complete and it is our practice to continue collecting the underpayment while our enquiries are ongoing.

I can however now spread the collection of the underpayment over 2 years starting on 6 April 2013.

Our records are not linked to the Tax credits system, and would not be reviewed as part of your claim.

So they are writing to the employer to see if it was there error and if so, they should pay the underpayment.

If they find that to be the case, your friend will have the extra deductions refunded to her.

Plus they have agreed to spread it over 2 years which i think is pretty fair to be honest.

Your friend should try to recall if she ever signed a P46 declaration, i bet she didnt, they prob filled it in and submitted it online.

Secondly, your friend should maybe reply to HMRC's letter and thank them, say please note, i never signed a P46 and since the employer has stated on the P14 i was tax cumlative when infact i was taxed emergency, can only strengthen the fact that its the employers error thus should pay the underpayment.

Something along those lines.

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Just spoken on phone and she said when she spoken to employer, they confirmed they DID send off the copy of the P45 employer copy to HMRC and they also confirmed they have proof it was sent if the HMRC want to get in touch.
Luckily she gets on well with the team and they did say the HMRC are welcome by all means to get in touch, but they did receive the information, where they obviously have stated on the letter as shown above they have no records.......hmmm

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Right ok, she popped in her letter and not happy.
Nothing about the cheque, because the letter states the overpayment minusing the amount of what she would have had if no underpayment.

.................................................. ..................................

Thank you for your letter dated 19 November 2012 asking us not to collect £248.91 for the tax year 2010-11.
I am sorry that you feel we have not dealt with your tax record in a timely manner.

Decision:
We have considered your case under the Extra Statutory Concession (ESC)A19 which allows us not to collect tax in certain cases. Full details of ESCA19 are on the leaflet included with this letter and website...........

We are sorry but ESC does not apply in your case and the tax is still due.

Reasons for decision:
This is because we have no record of any information sent by you or third party which we failed to act on. If you think we have overlooked information that has been sent to us, please let us know.

What information was provided
When it was sent to us
Who sent it

Please note that the end of the year and tax details sent to us by your employer is not classed as information for purposes of ESC A19.

2010-11
Please note that your records show that when you commenced employment with (recent employer) we received an online form which is used by new employer where the P45 from previous employer is not available. The form P4 requests that one of the three statements are signed, and depending on which statement is signed a correct tax code is used by the employer. The original tax code of 647L week 1 basis operated by the employer suggests that you signed statement B as follows:

B: This is my only job since last April 6, I have had another job, or received taxable jobseekers allowance, employment support allowance or taxable incapacity benefit. I do not receive a State or Occupational pension scheme.

This would mean that you paid the correct amount of tax, but only from the day your employer used the tax code until 5 April 2011.

The end of year return form P14 submitted by (recent employer) shows that they used 647L cumulative without the previous pay and tax from Previous employer, so in affect you received two separate personal allowances.

In certain circumstances we can ask the employer (or pension provider) to pay an underpayment of tax if it results from their error. I will write to employer for their explanation. I will write to you again when I have concluded my enquiries.

I am afraid these enquries can take some time to complete and it is our practice to continue collecting the underpayment while our enquiries are ongoing.

I can however now spread the collection of the underpayment over 2 years starting on 6 April 2013.

Our records are not linked to the Tax credits system, and would not be reviewed as part of your claim.

.................................................. .......

With that, there is an explanation "if you do not agree with the decision" with a form to complete "I do not agree with your decision to refuse my claim under ESC A19" and to give additional information below.

.................................................. ....................................

Right ok, I have not actually seen the letter she originally sent them, but she did say that she does not understand where ESC A19 has come into it, when she believes its down to the emloyer??

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Not heard from her today, so whether or not she did get to ring and ask if she will be getting the cheque from the one of them??

[SXGuy]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

True, you know, years ago, you could ring HMRC speak to someone, explain the situation, deal with the matter, have it ressolved, say no more.

These days, you have to do this, that, something else, wait, wait more, get a reply you dont agree with, appeal to that, wait, wait more, get the answer you hoped for, or not lol.

It is compartmentalised so much so, that you lack the ability to put a proper case forward, and they rely on this in my opinion.

For example, we used to be able to ring, speak to an inspector, explain a situation, he would amend it from his end while on the phone, not anymore.

[cymruambyth]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

It's quite surprising how compartmentalised everything is. The call centres seem to have very basic information and ......

[SXGuy]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

They may not have much info on their screen to be honest, may just say something like, appeal received, and assigned etc.

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Just spoken to her, and she got through only to be told, it's being dealt with, then she said she forgot to mention about the cheque lol, "doh" I told her to ring again tomorrow.

So at least its being dealt with, but she said they did not give much away really.

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Arh right, yes that would make sense.

Lol, okey dokie, I shall pass on the tel number anyway, thank you both.

[SXGuy]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Cym is correct, very rarely use emails for anything. Only time ive ever been able to use an email is to submit a flat rate vat application LOL

[cymruambyth]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

I don't think they use emails; there are too many scams with tax and all the ads say that they never contact you by email.

[di30]

Re: P800 Tax Calculation help

Just a thought, I take it there is no email contact to them by any chance?
She still has no access to the puter, but now and again will use her mum's.