Think I need to go BR!

[Riz]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

The only other thing I would say, is if you do decide that you actually WANT to go BR sooner rather than later, then it's usually better to get on and do it yourself. Plus the sooner you do it, then the sooner down the line you and your credit files are clear.

A lot of creditors may threaten bankruptcy, but unless you have stonking amounts of assets then most would be nuts to make you bankrupt.

It costs a creditor £1,500 plus in up front fees/costs to do it, and most of the time they are unlikely to see any of that back, let alone any of the original debt.

HMRC, Amex, some councils and a few building trade creditors will sometimes make you BR, even if they would end up losing out. Plus a few rare cases with DCAs that have an 'insane' moment.

With all the rest you are likely to gets threats but no follow through.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Ok, it's late and I've been working all day. Am I missing something here, please spell it out as I'm feeling dim!

Hand keys back then walk.

Plain enough for you?

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Well my creditors are :

NRAM - Bad Northern Rock - Circa £120k (But asset back of £110k)
Santander - Personal Loan for car circa £15k
Egg - Credit card of circa £12k (UE)
Barclaycard Platinum - Circa £3.5k (UE)
Barclaycard Premier - Circa £15k (UE)
Cahoot > Abbey > Santander - Flexible Loan - Circa £15k (UE)

So ... if I go BR, two options:

1) Do it myself and get the ball rolling, and over and done with sooner.
2) Risk Letting the creditors take the action and pay the fees to make me BR. If this likelihood is low, then shouldn't I just leave it and sit still, and ignore calls/letters etc?

Guaranteed that 5 years and 11 months down the line they take me to court!! :P

If I go with option 2, then do they have any other recourse ... is it filing to make me BR, or nothing?

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hand keys back then walk.

Plain enough for you?

Crystal!

[helmsman]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Well my creditors are :

NRAM - Bad Northern Rock - Circa £120k (But asset back of £110k)
Santander - Personal Loan for car circa £15k
Egg - Credit card of circa £12k (UE)
Barclaycard Platinum - Circa £3.5k (UE)
Barclaycard Premier - Circa £15k (UE)
Cahoot > Abbey > Santander - Flexible Loan - Circa £15k (UE)

So ... if I go BR, two options:

1) Do it myself and get the ball rolling, and over and done with sooner.
2) Risk Letting the creditors take the action and pay the fees to make me BR. If this likelihood is low, then shouldn't I just leave it and sit still, and ignore calls/letters etc?

Guaranteed that 5 years and 11 months down the line they take me to court!! :P

If I go with option 2, then do they have any other recourse ... is it filing to make me BR, or nothing?

Hi,
Have just read the thread no advice to offer but you have been given good advice, just wanted to say,
BEST OF LUCK WHATEVER YOU DECIDE.

[PlanB]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Good Morning FF, I think you said you went ahead with the purchase of your current home (your post 86 on this thread) when the other one's sale fell through (the one you now let out). I know nothing about BR but it's worth checking what impact it would have on where you live now and whether that too would be vulnerable after 12 months into the BR. I didn't pick up on whether that property has any equity in it. I may of course have got this all wrong because I'm not bright first thing in the morning! Ask an expert on this point.

You also said your parents might offer to use their savings to help you out. Ok this is a daft thought but what if they actually wanted to buy one of the properties off you as an investment for their old age? You can get Buy-to-Let mortgages that run until you're 80 years old as long as the maths add up. My ex-husband sold his (our house actually) to his new wife for well below the market value before he went BR and they still live in it to this day (15 years later) and it's doubled in value. I only want to throw out some ideas and not confuse you so don't give any of this a second thought if you know already what direction you're heading. Just ignore me - most people do!

Have a nice day,
Plan B x

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Good Morning FF, I think you said you went ahead with the purchase of your current home (your post 86 on this thread) when the other one's sale fell through (the one you now let out). I know nothing about BR but it's worth checking what impact it would have on where you live now and whether that too would be vulnerable after 12 months into the BR. I didn't pick up on whether that property has any equity in it. I may of course have got this all wrong because I'm not bright first thing in the morning! Ask an expert on this point.

You also said your parents might offer to use their savings to help you out. Ok this is a daft thought but what if they actually wanted to buy one of the properties off you as an investment for their old age? You can get Buy-to-Let mortgages that run until you're 80 years old as long as the maths add up. My ex-husband sold his (our house actually) to his new wife for well below the market value before he went BR and they still live in it to this day (15 years later) and it's doubled in value. I only want to throw out some ideas and not confuse you so don't give any of this a second thought if you know already what direction you're heading. Just ignore me - most people do!

Have a nice day,
Plan B x

Hi Plan B,

Thanks for your reply.

Ah I think I've confused you.

I bought a house, lets call it House "A" ... then I needed to move, so bought House "B". The sale for House "A" fell through, so I decided to rent it out, and proceeded to buy House "B". Then my partner and I split up and I've recently sold House "B", and in turn I've moved into a rented house "C".

So currently:
I am landlord of House "A" - 2 Bed - No equity.
I am tenant of House "C" - 5 Bed

If I told my parents about my scenario, they would bend over backwards to help. But, I'm not prepared to tell them. I fear it would send one if not both of them to an early grave. Over the years they have cleared my credit cards three or four times, they have helped me with a deposit for two houses, and even given me a couple of cars. This current situation would be the straw that broke the camels back, I'm big enough and old enough now to sort out my own mess, and I need to do it for myself.

There is no point them buying my House "A" as an investment, they are both retired and have plenty of investments, and would not make anything from buying my old house at all. Other than severed relationships, stress etc.

Surely if I sold the House "A" to my current partner, then the OR would investigate it, and see it as dumping assets ... or fraudulent behaviour?

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Today's Dilemma:

Today is payday, and I was due to make the repayment of a pay-day loan. But I'd forgotten that the card details they have on file are incorrect, as my card has just been replaced due to fraud!

So I got an email this morning saying "Payment Failed".

Now, if I'm going to do as Niddy et al suggested and just walk away from everything until one of them decides to make me BR, then do I just mail them back and say "Sorry I'm going BR, I've been advised not to pay!".

Or would the honourable thing be to repay this?

Question 2:
My three items that are legitimately owed, and I can't rebut as Unenforceable are:
Mortgage for House A
Personal Loan for Car
PayDay Loan.

Now, as explained before, they would have to spend £1500 to file to make me BR. But before they get to that stage, what other options do they have? Can they issue a court summons for a CCJ and Payment Order???

Sorry for tons of questions, I'm just wondering what the route of options would be. Thanks

[LooLoo]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hi

someone will probably answer your questions a bit better than me.....

I would think in the case of the Loans they would probably take it and get a CCJ - but again you know how long this process can take it won't be quick.

Mortgage - i guess they would go for re-possesion - if that happens you say you have tenants in the house? just wondered how all this will impact them?

Obviously you have to do what is best for you.

In my opinion if you have deciced the best way for you is to go BR then I would probably get the ball rolling myself - just stop paying everthing and get the money together for court??

but as i said see what others have to say

[PlanB]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

My mistake about the house buying thing. Others will explain about the disposing of assets prior to BR malarkey, but has she got the same name as you? Probably not . . . Anyway who says you're going BR yet.

I completely understand the parent non-involvement approach. What a nice person you are to want to spare them any worry - wish my daughter was like that.

I spotted the 5 bedroom opportunity in your current home. Have you considered the Rent-a-Room scheme? It's a way of taking in lodgers without paying tax (up to a £4,250 limit pa?) as part of a HMRC deal set up when they gave up on pursuing people who do it anyway to avoid tax. My friend Ros has two in her house which she sourced from www.mondaytofriday.com and www.fivenights.com . That way she only has to tolerate them during the week and they bugger off at weekends. Simples. Their rent covers her mortgage shortfall and they share the odd glass of wine or a beer for fun too. Just a thought.

I'm not going to say any more for now because my daughter will say I'm being a busy-body, but I wish you well in your decisions.

I just thought that if all your unsecured debt (with the exception of the car) is truly unenforceable, and you've only got £10k in negative equity you may be able to ride out the storm. After all as long as that house increases in value by 1% in your lifetime you'll be back in positive territory. Although you do descibe the neighbourhood as being a bit 'colourful' (what with all those syringes etc!). I don't know what agents charge to sell stuff in your neck of the woods, but if the lender puts it into auction you would normally still have to pay the auction costs with repossession, and it gets sold at a knock-down price too. I have absoltuley no idea what happens to houses and BR so please ask a wise guy on this website, but in my experience (yup it happened to me in the 90s) the lender can chase the borrower for up to 6 years (or even 12 in some circumstances) for the shortfall. Also most lenders (and I think NR may be one) buy in-house Mortgage Indemnity Guarantees to protect themselves. This means that the lenders claims any shortfall off their insurer and then the insurer chases the borrower for 6 (or 12 years). That's why lenders don't mind bunging repossessions into auction because they won't lose out whatever it sells for.

I'm off now and I've probably said too much and I'll get a slapped wrist from a moderater. Eeek.

Plan B x

[LooLoo]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hey PB no slaps from me! )))

Riz will be able to tell you more about the shortfall - from what I understood (but please wait until someone confirms this) once you are BR that is it but you have to make sure you NEVER EVER sign anything from the lender regarding the shortfall..... Again this is what I was told a couple of years back when I was looking but please as I said wait until someone confirms who knows a bit more than me.

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hi

someone will probably answer your questions a bit better than me.....

I would think in the case of the Loans they would probably take it and get a CCJ - but again you know how long this process can take it won't be quick.

Mortgage - i guess they would go for re-possesion - if that happens you say you have tenants in the house? just wondered how all this will impact them?

Obviously you have to do what is best for you.

In my opinion if you have deciced the best way for you is to go BR then I would probably get the ball rolling myself - just stop paying everthing and get the money together for court??

but as i said see what others have to say

Hiya Looooo Loooo ... how are you?

Ok, so the loans might just end up in a CCJ action then? Hmmm. Need to investigate how I get from that to BR.

Mortgage, I'd hand the keys back in Sept when the tenant moves out.

I've previously spoken with a financial advisor who is local to me, and one of the OR's for my region. She was most helpful, I shall get her advice.

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hey PB no slaps from me! )))

Riz will be able to tell you more about the shortfall - from what I understood (but please wait until someone confirms this) once you are BR that is it but you have to make sure you NEVER EVER sign anything from the lender regarding the shortfall..... Again this is what I was told a couple of years back when I was looking but please as I said wait until someone confirms who knows a bit more than me.

That was my assumption, ONCE you are BR, then there is nothing they can do to try to claim money from you .. unless you're daft enough to sign to accept it again!

[LooLoo]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hey all good with me

As I said I think you will find very few lenders will acutally take the step to make you BR - it is only HMRC and I think for some bizarre reason (someone correct me if I am wrong) AMEX. For mortgages they will go for re-possession and then chase you for the shortfall (i think)

Sorry I know I keep saying I think a lot - but I don't want to give you the wrong advice and it was about 2 years ago that I was looking down this path - but the other guys Riz/Phil/Confuzzed and If can probably shed more light

As I said if BR is the way forward then i think the best way is to just get the ball rolling yourself otherwise you could be in for a long wait

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Stop thinking so deep into this, we're going round in the same circles here!

Ok, if you have decided to go BR then quite simply, yes - walk away and see IF (huge if in bold neon colours) anyone wants to make you BR. They may not, great! I suspect none will and also suspect not many will bother with a ccj - they still need to know where you're at and if you just moved and have not told them, and have no intention of applying for credit then it'll take a while anyway!