Think I need to go BR!

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Ah ok. No problem.

So from a personal perspective. I realise prior to BR things must have been very bad, to consider BR. But post BR, were you left watching every penny and worrying about the car needing tyres or the odd house emergency. Or did you feel that you were able to save small amounts to cover eventualities?

[philnicandamy]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Its not half as bad as you imagine it will be to be honest...

the receivers office did allow a few bits so what I did every month? any spare I had left I hadnt used stuck away in an online ybs savings account (they take BR's) that way I had a little stashed away should I need one day

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Crikey you reply quicker than I do!!!

That sounds great. At present I've moved my accounts to Co-Op (2 x current and 1 x savings), and also have a pre-paid Orange Mastercard (powered by Barclays I think).

I'm sure it will be fine, I just need to do it and stop procrastinating!

[LooLoo]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Good luck with this all FF - I know I seriously looked in to BR at one point so I can imagine the emotions you are going through - you are in good hands here

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Aye ... I was a little disconcerted when a good friend told me that he went with the baliffs to a personal property and took almost everything. He was convinced that all my belongings would be taken.

I had to tell him that the baliffs only come when it's a case of not paying government taxes, such as Council Tax or Income Tax etc.

Or at least, that's how I understand it to be.

I'd love to go there with the paperwork, the court to take my worries away, and then have a few years making payments. I'd prefer not to have any of my stuff sold

[kilasuit]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

only little point to make out on all this would be to get the house you own valued. and estimate it along with other propertys on the market.

Your talking a HUGE change in your life. Moreso than marriage IMHO. At least with marriage you could get a divorce etc and do a runner from the OH if she (generalised due to me being male) was that nuts.

as seen posted on other thread i think that company car and moving into your own "owned" house makes much more sense

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hi Kilasuit, thanks for your input.

The outstanding mortgage on the house I own is about £118k, recent sales have been for less than this, £105k-110k region.

Whilst I understand the ethos of moving back into my old house, there are a few things stopping me doing this:

• Psychological issues of going back 10 years
• House is unsuitable due to size. Work requires me to have a room assigned as an office. The other place is only 2 bed, meaning my son wouldn't have a bedroom.
• The new neighbours party all night, drugs, theft, vandalism.

Thanks, but if I could sell it, I would!

It's possible I would get a tenant when the other one vacates at the end of Sept, but it may be empty for a month or so, which I cannot afford.

So am I just delaying the inevitable .. by funding it, when realistically I can't afford to keep it on?

[PlanB]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Aye ... I was a little disconcerted when a good friend told me that he went with the baliffs to a personal property and took almost everything. He was convinced that all my belongings would be taken.

I'd love to go there with the paperwork, the court to take my worries away, and then have a few years making payments. I'd prefer not to have any of my stuff sold

Haven't you got a friend with a garage . . . ?

My ex-husband went BR to avoid child maintenance when we divorced. He did fine because his business gave him a 'company' credit card with his name on it so he could still wine & dine (her not me sadly) etc without having to pay cash everywhere. Maybe your job will do the same because it's perfectly legal - the company has a line of credit not you. His new wife (I hate her) set up a limited company and 'bought' his assets for a song. She had a big garage. In fact a pair of big garages if I remember rightly.

Don't worry about your parents. If they sound cross with you it's probably because they're genuinely worried underneath all that bravado. If my daughter went BR I would only be cross if she didn't come to me first for help. Obviously I'd give her a slap for being silly with money, but then I was stupid with money at her age too so pot calling kettle black springs to mind. I couldn't bail her out but I would hold her hand through the process. My finances are pretty rough right now and I've considered BR but I'm not sure what I'll tell her. I don't think she'd buy into the story that Mummy's selling up to go on a Gap Year (I'm 61 years old).

As far as I can see BR can sometimes be a brilliant commericial move to take (bugger the stigma). Just call it financial restructuring like HSBC and Barclays do!

Very good luck,
Plan B x

[PlanB]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

I've just read your thread from the start and I sense you're not convinced that BR is the way forward for you. I may be wrong but you say you want out of the stress more than anything and I can relate to that. Sometimes (not always) lenders will co-operate on Buy-to-Lets in difficulty, not because they give a damn about you but because they don't want the problem on their books either. A repossession is a statistic they could do without especially if the'yre 'State Owned' such as Northern Rock (is that your lender?). If it was a Buy-to-Let mortgage then it won't get repossessed automatically it may go into Receivership with no court hearing etc (that'll be spelt out in your mortgage Ts & Cs). Buy-to-Lets are not regulated by the FSA and they are treated differently (in most cases). The lender will then usually rent it out for a bit (and keep the dosh to pay the mortgage) and you can get it back out of receivership sometimes (not guaranteed). This won't be the case if it's a residential mortgage and you've let it discreetly in which case ignore this useless information. Why not ask the lender for a mortgage holiday for 2 months - got to be worth a try? I don't know the shape and size or the location of the property but rents are truly on the up-and-up so before you throw in the towel are you certain that'll you'll be letting it at a mega loss from now on?

I'm not a moderater or anything fancy like that but I am a fighter because I'm a parent like you and giving up just isn't an option to me. But I can see that you've been given splendid professional advice from this site so feel free to dismiss my humble thoughts - I just want to cheer you up. All is so not lost!

[confused76]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

6) Looking at my SoA, if I have a tenant in my property, it seems that I can make reduced payments to my creditors. However if I don't have a tenant, I am a definite candidate for BR ... but afterwards I would still have a £500 excess each month. My partner is wanting to move in. If she has moved in, then I would certainly have little to no "disposable" income left for a Payments Order. Is it wise to get her to move in, or would the OR look at this unfavourably?
.

hi FF i just wanted to pick up on this point again. you say that living on your own you would, post br, have approx £500 disposable income. if your partner moved in you say you'd have little disposable income, can you explain why? the only reason i'm asking is the OR would expect your partner to contribute to the joint bills, so in theory you would have more not less disposable income after basics....see what i mean? unless i'm being dumb and missing something

i just wanted to point out that the OR would expect your partner to contribute to the joint bills, wouldn't want you to go br and get a shock xx

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Hey PlanB,

Thank you so much for that reply.

Ok, let me reply to some of your comments.

I do have friends with garages, and would happily give them TV's, computers etc to look after. Plus, I can argue that some of the furniture in my house belongs to my partner, as she has finance for it. Interestingly my furniture matches hers, so I could go further and argue that it is all my partners furniture, as she bought matching stuff and only financed the extra bits she couldn't afford. I could say she let me use it, since I gave mine away when splitting with my ex!

I do have a company credit card. It's the company card, but I am listed as "responsible" for it. That said, I cannot make any purchases on it, unless it has been pre-approved by the expense procedure. So, really it's of no use unless I'm on company business. Even then it's hardly accepted anywhere!!


To be perfectly honest with you, no, I'm not convinced that BR is my best option. If I mentioned it to my parent's, it's likely that they would cash in some of their savings and bail me out. But that is the last thing in the world I would want to do. They have bailed me out so many times before, that I'd hate to see the stress on their faces.

I have three items of concern:

• House I rent out - Mortgage is at £118k, and worth approx £105-110k. It was a residential mortgage, that when I moved, the buyer dropped out at the last minute. I decided to continue with my new purchase, and to rent it out. To cover times when there is a change of tenants, I usually go for a payment holiday. The issue being that I don't think I've got a payment holiday due in September. I can speak to them about it, and hopefully they will be understanding.
  
  The mortgage company NRAM (The BAD Northern Rock ... you guessed right) found out I was letting it out. I sent them a letter saying "I realise I've done wrong, but I have a tenant in there and it's paying the mortgage, so let me continue renting it, or come and repossess it". I was given "Permission to Let". So I think it's still a residential mortgage, but with permission to let the property.
  
  Each time I take a payment holiday, it increases my monthly payments. I've rented the property for about 3 years now, and been making an increasing loss each time. Currently mortgage, insurance etc equal about £500 a month, and income is £400 a month. I'm carrying over a net loss on the accounts from year to year.
  
  When I have good tenants, it's not too bad, as I don't get much hassle. But the recent one has had break-ins, and the shower broke, she wanted the window locks replacing etc. All of these items are things I have to pay for, but cannot budget for. For instance if the boiler breaks, I am liable to replace it, yet cannot afford to do so.
  
  I think in real terms I think it would need in the next 5 years, a new boiler, double glazing throughout, a new kitchen and a new bathroom. Granted for rental market it doesn't have to be as nicely kitted out as for sale, hence the old bathroom etc.
  
  Summary:
  Net loss
  Unexpected bills
  No sign of profit for a while yet
  
  
• Personal Loan for car loan - When buying the car which I have just sold, I arranged a personal loan. The loan is now defaulted and is circa £15k. Santander are being particularly bullish and ignoring my letters and bouncing it off to debt recovery agents. I inform the debt recovery agents that I'm dealing directly with Santander, and so they return it to Sandander. Rinse and repeat. This one, I realise I'm going to have to start paying shortly.
  
  
• All other lines of debt - Credit cards and loans. These are all ticking away happily with being rebutted via the Unenforcability process. With Niddy's excellent help. I'm sure that three or four of the five lines of debt, I may get away with the UE process for the 6 years. But it only takes one of them to take me to court and I'd end up with a CCJ or payment order.
  

Considering the options, I could:
Option 1:
Struggle along with the house, finding a tenant, and hoping to cover unexpected bills.
Arrange payments for the car, and hope to slowly reduce it. But £15k would take forever to pay off via a DMP, or personal agreement.
Continue the UE process for the other debt, and hope none of them take it to court.


Option 2:
Arrange an IVA, this would cover the personal loan for the car and other lines of credit ... but would take 5 years maybe 6, and leave me in the same state as BR. But I'd still be stuck with a house which is a money pit at present.


Option 3:
Go BR, and get rid of the house, personal loan for the car, and other lines of credit. I'd be paying for 3 years vs 6 years. I'd also be screwed for credit for 6 years. I would however get rid of the house.

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

hi FF i just wanted to pick up on this point again. you say that living on your own you would, post br, have approx £500 disposable income. if your partner moved in you say you'd have little disposable income, can you explain why? the only reason i'm asking is the OR would expect your partner to contribute to the joint bills, so in theory you would have more not less disposable income after basics....see what i mean? unless i'm being dumb and missing something

i just wanted to point out that the OR would expect your partner to contribute to the joint bills, wouldn't want you to go br and get a shock xx

Hi, thanks for asking ... id rather you all asked me, so I didn't trip up on something.

Ok, she currently gets circa £550 a month in tax credits and child tax credits, which she would lose if she moved in with me. The increase in food bill for her and her daughter, the council tax increase from single person discount, and the increase in gas, elec and water ... I would imaging would/could eat up that 500 difference.

On paper, she has enough money to cover her own bills for her car, her mobile phone, her payments for her furniture and her daughters costs. As it stands, if she moved in and didn't pay a penny towards any of the house bills or food costs, she would be left with about £50 a month to herself.

[fiscalfool]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Just wanted to thank you all for taking a personal interest, and not just advising me on the route I thought I needed, but also questioning other options. Thank you

[PlanB]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

Just wanted to thank you all for taking a personal interest, and not just advising me on the route I thought I needed, but also questioning other options. Thank you

Glass half full not half empty eh?

[IF]

Re: Think I need to go BR!

FF just me here checking that you have spoken to a Debt charity as well, re my post on page 1.

I think I agree with Confused if you have £500 surplus before GF moves in the OR will expect her to pay half bills Council tax, electric etc.

That means you could have to pay more than £500 a month to the OR for 3 years!!

Best wishes
If...x