lorings UE Diary

[garlok]

Re: lorings UE Diary

In a word NO. This is all a ploy to get you to contact them and trap you into acknowledging the debt. I assume you have not paid them anything or acknowledged the debt in any way since?

regards
Garlok

[loring]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi everyone
My RBS Account was defaulted on 14th August 2005 and the 6 year period was due to drop off in about 10 days time. Today I have received a letter and another Default Notice from RBS. I will transmit to Niddy later today hopefully for his advice.
Their letter thanks me for "letting RBS know that you are unable to correct the position on your account because of financial problems". I have never informed this at all.
The Default Notice is dated 21st July 2011 and gives me 17days to clear my arrears of £4000.
Can they put a second default on this account on my account or can I have it removed. I do not wish to phone them about this. Any advice welcome in the meantime.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Niddy
My RBS (MINT) Account
Thanks for your advice and letter template, I have sent the letter off today(modified it to suit)and will wait and see what happens.
I don't have much confidence in the ICO having had responses on other issues from them.
Thanks
loring

I understand your frustration however if they fob you off we'll report them to the FOS

[loring]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Niddy
My RBS (MINT) Account
Thanks for your advice and letter template, I have sent the letter off today(modified it to suit)and will wait and see what happens.
I don't have much confidence in the ICO having had responses on other issues from them.
Thanks
loring

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: lorings UE Diary

See here for relevant SAR chase-up letter: Creditor Refusal of SAR

ICO complaint is also necessary, not because they will do anything, but it'll help any possible legal action you may need to take.

Whilist I appreciate the advice above is sound, what you need to remember is the ICO do not have the same powers as a regulator and thus anything they request, that is not adhered to goes unpunished which is why it's a joke.

You can go to the ico and if they find in your favour and the bank piss-about then you'll be able to take action against the bank for the faults, based on that outcome and the history of facts. That said, it's not something we suggest here - ie we NEVER suggest taking action against a lender - it is just too risky.

If the lender takes action against you, so be it - we fight them. We do not start the fight and ergo, I never mentioned half of the above because in your case it simply is not worth it.

So I suggest, as I did previously, resend the SAR using the added template above and inform the ICO and then leave it at that until you get a response from the ICO.

If the ICO do not find in your favour and/or they back up the bank then complain to the FOS.

No need to learn the legislation, put simply they have failed to adequately respond to your s.7 request for personal data. That in itself means all the ICO will do is tell them to expedite the process and deal with you.

I hate the ICO and the body they purport to be.

[Angry Cat]

Re: lorings UE Diary

True, but there is a time limit specified -ie- they do not have to comply with an SAR request if submitted a second time too soon after the first. Obviously that wouldn't apply here, BUT why should Loring pay another £10 when she's entitled to the information under law? The obvious answer is if she needs it quickly, but definitely a case for the ICO and formal complaint to RBS.

Loring, should have sent RBS a reminder to fully comply with his/her SAR.

If, it were me I would write again to RBS setting out my concerns and tell them to fully comply.

Also, make a formal complaint to the ICO:
http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/documen...o_complain.pdf

[caspar]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Casper There is a lot of legal jargon to understand about the Data Protection Act, I am working on that.
Thanks everyone
loring

Anything you don't understand, just ask. I've just copied the main bits I thought were most relevant to you.

[caspar]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Furthermore, there is nothing in the Act that prevents one from making a second SAR.

Report RBS to the ICO.

True, but there is a time limit specified -ie- they do not have to comply with an SAR request if submitted a second time too soon after the first. Obviously that wouldn't apply here, BUT why should Loring pay another £10 when she's entitled to the information under law? The obvious answer is if she needs it quickly, but definitely a case for the ICO and formal complaint to RBS.

[loring]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Angry Cat,Caspar and Pompeyfaith
All I have been able to get from RBS(MINT)is 6 years statements and a copy of an unenforceable application form. They ignore everything else including the PPI information and even all the correspondences between me and them. I am checking out the posts from yourself Casper and Pompeyfaith, I need to establish how exactly to approach this and perhaps Niddy will have some advice.
Anyway I have put the account in dispute and stopped paying them around a year ago. What they have sent me is unenforceable and I do not recall ever having received any credit agreement. I would like to be able to reclaim the PPI and any charges and write off the account.
Pompeyfaith can you point me to the HMRC regulations which state they should hold documents for 12 years, I know the money laundering regulations require records to be held for a minimum of 6 years from closing the account. The account dates back to 1997/8.
Casper There is a lot of legal jargon to understand about the Data Protection Act, I am working on that.
Thanks everyone
loring

[Angry Cat]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Data has to be held for 12 years at least for HMRC use.

12 years under the Money Laundering Regs;
6 years under the DPA.

[pompeyfaith]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Data has to be held for 12 years at least for HMRC use.

[Angry Cat]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Angry Cat
I submitted an SAR to RBS about 2 years ago and they only sent me 6 years statements and said that was all they had and that complied with the Data Protection Act. I have been writing to them ever since trying to get further info as they mis sold me PPI.
On the application form I signed I did not tick the box offering PPI but they applied it anyway. I phoned them up at the time to ask them what these payments were on my account and they told me it was protection insurance and I would not be given a card without it, it was compulsory. I did nothing more about it then, I did not know any better.
Recently they wrote and informed me that if if sent them £10 they would send me all the statements for the account from inception.
This sounded good as I could then work out my claim for PPI mis- selling.
Then they have had second thoughts and said the offer to give me all the statements was a mistake and they sent back the £10. I do not know if I can do anything about it.

RBS, are well known to the ICO for not fully complying with SAR's.
I, along with many others have had to report them to the ICO!

RBS may well have complied with the DPA if, they have provided you with 6 years statements.
But, if they have not provided to you any and all historic data relating to the account, they have not.

Did they provide copies of log comms and all details relating to the PPI?

Furthermore, there is nothing in the Act that prevents one from making a second SAR.

Report RBS to the ICO.

[caspar]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Loring,

I've outlined below what I consider the main parts of the DPA 1998 regarding your SAR. It would appear to me they are in breach of the DPA and so should be reported to the ICO for enforcement action to be taken. Nowhere does it state a 6 year limit. Indeed I believe banks have to keep them readily available for 6 years and then on record for a significantly longer time.

The Fundamental Principles underpinning the act are enforceable at law should the need arise.

Personally I would not just give up. It has to be worth at least a complaint to the ICO, there's also a section on appeals should the ICO not rule in your favour.

Hope this helps,

Caspar



Right of access to personal data.
(1) Subject to the following provisions of this section and to [F16sections 8, 9 and 9A], an
individual is entitled—
(a) to be informed by any data controller whether personal data of which that
individual is the data subject are being processed by or on behalf of that data
controller,
(b) if that is the case, to be given by the data controller a description of—
(i) the personal data of which that individual is the data subject,
(ii) the purposes for which they are being or are to be processed, and
(iii) the recipients or classes of recipients to whom they are or may be
disclosed,
(c) to have communicated to him in an intelligible form—
(i) the information constituting any personal data of which that individual
is the data subject, and
8 Data Protection Act 1998 (c. 29)
Part II – Rights of data subjects and others
Document Generated: 2011-01-28
Status: This version of this Act contains provisions that are prospective.
Changes to legislation: There are outstanding changes not yet made by the legislation.gov.uk
editorial team to Data Protection Act 1998. Any changes that have already been made by the
team appear in the content and are referenced with annotations. (See end of Document for details)
(ii) any information available to the data controller as to the source of those
data, and
(d) where the processing by automatic means of personal data of which that
individual is the data subject for the purpose of evaluating matters relating
to him such as, for example, his performance at work, his creditworthiness,
his reliability or his conduct, has constituted or is likely to constitute the sole
basis for any decision significantly affecting him, to be informed by the data
controller of the logic involved in that decision-taking.
(2) A data controller is not obliged to supply any information under subsection (1) unless
he has received—
(a) a request in writing, and
(b) except in prescribed cases, such fee (not exceeding the prescribed maximum)
as he may require.



8ss2 (2) The obligation imposed by section 7(1)(c)(i) must be complied with by supplying the
data subject with a copy of the information in permanent form unless—
(a) the supply of such a copy is not possible or would involve disproportionate
effort, or
(b) the data subject agrees otherwise;
and where any of the information referred to in section 7(1)(c)(i) is expressed in terms
which are not intelligible without explanation the copy must be accompanied by an
explanation of those terms.



13 13 Compensation for failure to comply with certain requirements.
(1) An individual who suffers damage by reason of any contravention by a data controller of
any of the requirements of this Act is entitled to compensation from the data controller
for that damage.
(2) An individual who suffers distress by reason of any contravention by a data controller of
any of the requirements of this Act is entitled to compensation from the data controller
for that distress if—
(a) the individual also suffers damage by reason of the contravention, or
(b) the contravention relates to the processing of personal data for the special
purposes.


SCHEDULE 1 Section 4(1) and (2).
THE DATA PROTECTION PRINCIPLES
PART I
THE PRINCIPLES
1 Personal data shall be processed fairly and lawfully and, in particular, shall not be
processed unless—
(a) at least one of the conditions in Schedule 2 is met, and
(b) in the case of sensitive personal data, at least one of the conditions in Schedule 3
is also met.
2 Personal data shall be obtained only for one or more specified and lawful purposes, and
shall not be further processed in any manner incompatible with that purpose or those
purposes.
3 Personal data shall be adequate, relevant and not excessive in relation to the purpose or
purposes for which they are processed.
4 Personal data shall be accurate and, where necessary, kept up to date.
5 Personal data processed for any purpose or purposes shall not be kept for longer than
is necessary for that purpose or those purposes.
6 Personal data shall be processed in accordance with the rights of data subjects under
this Act.
7 Appropriate technical and organisational measures shall be taken against unauthorised
or unlawful processing of personal data and against accidental loss or destruction of,
or damage to, personal data.
8 Personal data shall not be transferred to a country or territory outside the European
Economic Area unless that country or territory ensures an adequate level of protection
for the rights and freedoms of data subjects in relation to the processing of personal data.


SHEDULE 2
The sixth principle
8 A person is to be regarded as contravening the sixth principle if, but only if—
(a) he contravenes section 7 by failing to supply information in accordance with
that section,
(b) he contravenes section 10 by failing to comply with a notice given under
subsection (1) of that section to the extent that the notice is justified or by failing
to give a notice under subsection (3) of that section,
(c) he contravenes section 11 by failing to comply with a notice given under
subsection (1) of that section, or
(d) he contravenes section 12 by failing to comply with a notice given under
subsection (1) or (2)(b) of that section or by failing to give a notification under
subsection (2)(a) of that section or a notice under subsection (3) of that section.

[loring]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Angry Cat
I submitted an SAR to RBS about 2 years ago and they only sent me 6 years statements and said that was all they had and that complied with the Data Protection Act. I have been writing to them ever since trying to get further info as they mis sold me PPI.
On the application form I signed I did not tick the box offering PPI but they applied it anyway. I phoned them up at the time to ask them what these payments were on my account and they told me it was protection insurance and I would not be given a card without it, it was compulsory. I did nothing more about it then, I did not know any better.
Recently they wrote and informed me that if if sent them £10 they would send me all the statements for the account from inception.
This sounded good as I could then work out my claim for PPI mis- selling.
Then they have had second thoughts and said the offer to give me all the statements was a mistake and they sent back the £10. I do not know if I can do anything about it.

[Angry Cat]

Re: lorings UE Diary

Hi Niddy

RBS (MINT
I requested my statements as Mint had offered.
Mint have written back saying
"Thank you for your letter dated 6th June 2011.
Unfortunately the information previously supplied to you in our letter was incorrect.
As a gesture of goodwill we enclose a cheque for £10 in refund of your payment for this service."
I guess there is nothing I can do now.
loring

Have RBS, supplied to you all the information that you requested under your DPA SAR?

If not make a complaint to the ICO!