Terrified of Ruthbridge

[swanfan]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

again, I am confused here - why are you asking for a CCA if the creditor has already said they cannot find one? That's it, you win - all you do is send a photocopy of that letter with this template here: -> CCA Query - Letter Previously Confirming No CCA and they'll soon stop hassling you!

What exactly are you trying to do here? You realise when something becomes UE the creditor and DCA's CAN and WILL chase you for repayment, all UE does is stop them from enforcing it via the courts!

MBNA have already admitted they have no CCA yea? If so send the letter that niddy mentioned above to them.

They can threaten all they like try not to worry.

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

I have just noticed something else this is NOT the MBNA debt as I first thought this is from a debt that was defaulted on 24th August 1999 and was assigned to Intrum Justitia in July 2004.

Intrum Justitia wrote to me on 3rd October 2008 after I CCA`d them returning my £1 and telling me the agreement was not available. I still have a copy of the letter from Intrum Justitia telling me that the agreement was not available and attaching list of my payments to them showing that I stopped paying them on 05/09/2009 after I had CCA`d them.

Really scared. What to do ??

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

The original debt was taken out with Barclays and they sold it on 15th July 2004. It isnt on my credit file BTW.

Following the letter from Intrum Justitia (above) I wrote back on 7th October 2008 telling them that I had written to them on 25th September 2008 requesting the CCA and that as they had been unable to comply with my request, the account entered default on 13th October 2008.

After that last letter I heard no more until Ruthbridge contacted me.

How can Ruthbridge be chasing this when Intrum Justitia even sent back my postal order ??

[swanfan]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

send a photocopy of that letter with this template here: -> CCA Query - Letter Previously Confirming No CCA and they'll soon stop hassling you!

Well they've admitted they can't supply it, send the above to them.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

I have just noticed something else this is NOT the MBNA debt as I first thought this is from a debt that was defaulted on 24th August 1999 and was assigned to Intrum Justitia in July 2004.

Intrum Justitia wrote to me on 3rd October 2008 after I CCA`d them returning my £1 and telling me the agreement was not available. I still have a copy of the letter from Intrum Justitia telling me that the agreement was not available and attaching list of my payments to them showing that I stopped paying them on 05/09/2009 after I had CCA`d them.

Really scared. What to do ??

Right, when did you last pay into this account? roughly? ahh shit, just seen in 2009.

Ok, go back a bit - we might be able to beat these bastards. Can you clarify when this was defaulted in 1999 - were you paying anything into the debt or not and if not, did you start paying again in 2004 or 2008?

I am looking for weaknesses - please be precise with your reply here - very important

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Reliant,

Don't worry about the letters!

They're just doing their job, that's what they get paid to do: send threat-o-grams! Just like we use generic template letters here on this site, with minimal changes, they are doing the same, i.e. sending templates to everyone using a mail merge program. Do you know how mail merge works? Basically you have a long list of names and addresses (a database), you open a template document with blank fields for name, address and account details and merge the two, producing 100s of identical letters to be sent out in the hope of stressing people out so much they pick up the phone and make a payment!

DON'T LET THEM GET AWAY WITH IT! You're playing into their hands if you do!

I also have a £7k debt with MBNA and they also failed to produce a CCA when I requested it. This was nearly two years ago and I have paid MBNA zilch, zero, nada, £0.00 since then!

No court, no bailiff, no problem, nothing to worry about!

The debt wasnt MBNA after all its originally from Barclays who sold it to Intrum Justitia in 2004 and who seem to have sold it to Ruthbridge. As Ruthbridge say at the beginning of their letter "We are writing to advise you that Intrum Justitia has appointed Experto Credite as asset managers" So it looks like Experto have in turn sold it on.

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Right, when did you last pay into this account? roughly? ahh shit, just seen in 2009.

Ok, go back a bit - we might be able to beat these bastards. Can you clarify when this was defaulted in 1999 - were you paying anything into the debt or not and if not, did you start paying again in 2004 or 2008?

I am looking for weaknesses - please be precise with your reply here - very important

The letter that Intrum sent me in October 2008 says that the agreement was entered into on 1th September 1997 and defaulted on 24 August 1999 and that a copy of the agreement is unavailable.

The deed of assignment was issued to Intrum Justitia on 15th July 2004.

It goes on to say that a total of 6 payments to the value of £1462.25 have been made to their client (Barclays ??) and a total of 46 payments to the value of £5730 have been made to Intrum.

The last payment to Intrum was made on 05/09/2008 and I CCA`d them on 25th September 2008.

After they had written to me on the 3rd October and told me the CCA was not available and returned my P.O. I wrote back on 7th October 2008 telling them that the account continued in dispute since then I have heard nothing until now.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Hi

I need to know what you did between default date (1999) and the date they wrote to you in 2008 ie were you paying at that point or not?

Going on the amount of payments, I am hoping to god that you tell me you started paying again in 2008 and between default date of 1999 and intrim's letter in 2008 that you never paid a bean - please tell me that

If so (and obviously true) then not only will I get you a refund of over £5k but the debt will be gone!

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Hi

I need to know what you did between default date (1999) and the date they wrote to you in 2008 ie were you paying at that point or not?

Going on the amount of payments, I am hoping to god that you tell me you started paying again in 2008 and between default date of 1999 and intrim's letter in 2008 that you never paid a bean - please tell me that

If so (and obviously true) then not only will I get you a refund of over £5k but the debt will be gone!

Between 01/11/1999 and 05/09/2008 I was still making payments. I stopped making any payments in 2008. I stopped paying after they defaulted on my CCA request. Are they able to enforce this because of this ??

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Shall I still send the letter that swanfan posted for me ??

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

Between 01/11/1999 and 05/09/2008 I was still making payments. I stopped making any payments in 2008. I stopped paying after they defaulted on my CCA request.

bugger

Are they able to enforce this because of this ??

Dunno without seeing the agreement but based on the lender being Barclays and the date - I would bet they don't have the agreement as per the letter you had thus you send the template that I posted originally yesterday and that Swanny reminded you of today, yes!

Do not pay another penny into this either

[reliant]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

OK Niddy. I send the letter and a copy of the one from Intrum saying they cannot produce the agreement ?

What happens if they do decide to take me to court ?? Is this likely ??

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

OK Niddy. I send the letter and a copy of the one from Intrum saying they cannot produce the agreement ?

Yes exactly - send it recorded and do not ever sign anything again as they "could" copy your signature

What happens if they do decide to take me to court ?? Is this likely ??

We'll help you defend and beat them

[mauijim]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

OK Niddy. I send the letter and a copy of the one from Intrum saying they cannot produce the agreement ?

What happens if they do decide to take me to court ?? Is this likely ??

Hi

I just thought I would try and add some reassurance from someone like me who is in a similar boat as you. I am having a real hard time since illness/accident ruined my life and dropped me in the brown stuff!

Try not to go into a tailspin when a letter from a DCA drops through your door threatening possible action if you fail to pay. That is what these muppets do for a living and they will throw any threat they can think of at you if it means you will part with some cash. 99% of the time their threats will remain as just that, threats! Niddy and his crew will ask you to post up the relevant details and then you must heed the advice.

Do you have a dedicated file folder for all the letters you send and receive? If yes, make sure everything has a separate section and keep a copy of EVERYTHING. If no, then get a folder and a hole punch. This is so important because it keeps all the info in one place and stops you from panicking about the owner of the debt, the dates, letters sent etc. Here is what I do

1. Letter from DCA arrives.
2. Relevant details are posted on here for Niddy and crew to advise.
3. Envelope is stapled to letter which is hole punched and added to my folder in date order.
4. Read advice from Niddy and Crew. If no action is advised then I chill and wait for the next letter.
5. If action is required i.e. template letter to be sent, I print it sign it digitally and then post it First Class Signed For.
6. Proof of posting is stapled to copy letter and added to the file
7. Sit back, chill and wait for next round of letters.

Trust me, I am up to my neck in the brown stuff and I was worried sick. I was not sleeping at night, I was making myself more ill and I was driving everyone mad. I realised that all the worrying in the world would not help me, it was better to relax where possible and just follow the advice from Niddy and crew.

I am very sorry to hear about your wife and I wish you all the best. Below is a copy of something I wrote to help Marling so give it the once over as it might help you too.

MJ

Hi Marling

As Niddy is always mega busy I thought I would try and explain the process of UE and very simple terms so you can understand it. I am just a layman like you and I'm also following the UE route so this is how I have been dealing with things. If there are any glaring errors, hopefully there won't be, then some of the mods will correct them.

UE is about us as consumers looking to use the laws of the consumer credit act to our advantage. It is not illegal, we are simply using the legal framework to fight back. I won't pretend to know the laws, Niddy and his crew handle that bit.

If you choose the UE path then basically you are asking the creditor to provide paperwork that legally enforces the debt. Quite simply, if they cannot provide paperwork that legally enforces the debt they cannot pursue you thought the courts to recover the money. They can register the debt with the credit reference agencies so your credit file will be shot to pieces. However, let's face it you probably knew that anyway. That is a brief summary of how it works. There will always be legal arguments and nuances that must be accounted for and Niddy will always make you aware of them.

So with the above in mind here is what you do and what you expect.


You send a CCA request to the owner of the debt. That could be the original creditor or the DCA chasing you. The DCA is responsible for supplying the CCA but many duck this and ask you to write to the original creditor. You have already experienced this so write to the original creditor.

You then wait for them to provide the CCA within 14 days. If they do not reply then they are in default and the ball is in their court to act next. You have reasonably asked for relevant paperwork and they are legally obliged to provide it.

So now they either provide something or they don't. If they provide something you let Niddy examine it and he will say if he deems it enforceable or unenforceable and will advise your next move. If they send nothing then the account remains in default and you do nothing but wait for them to reply. Basically you don't remind them about the account but if they start to chase you, show Niddy and the crew what they have sent and the correct advice on your next move will be given.

The account will be taken out of default if they subsequently provide a CCA prior to the debt being statute barred (6 years in England and 5 years (I think) in Scotland). When they send you something, then let Niddy see it and heed his advice.

Ultimately, only a judge can deem something enforceable or unenforceable but the aim of using UE is to find sufficient legal doubt on dubious cases that means a creditor would not risk court proceedings. I have learned the hard way that once you get before a judge anything can happen...oh and it gets expensive.

Some will be blatantly UE and so they are highly unlikely to get off the starting block. If they are dubious then listen to Niddy and the crew and they will advise on the correct response.

Creditors must act within the legal framework of the Consumer Credit Act and Niddy is advising you if in his opinion they are doing so. It becomes a game of legal tennis and you MUST be guided by Niddy and his crew. If the creditor is not working within the framework of the act then Niddy will tell you and then you are in the driving seat. They can make all sorts of wild and woolly threats but they will just remain as threats.

[SaltnVinegar]

Re: Terrified of Ruthbridge

OK Niddy. I send the letter and a copy of the one from Intrum saying they cannot produce the agreement ?

What happens if they do decide to take me to court ?? Is this likely ??

Hi reliant

Ok, easier said than done but first thing you need to do here is take a deep breath and calm down.

You're not helping your situation by jumping at shadows and making assumptions which means you have been getting advice which wasn't pertinent to your situation and getting you confused and worried.

The best thing you can do at this point, to help yourself, and help others here help you is to do a chronological list of events and what has happened with this account since its inception.

This will make your life easier as it will mean people will be able to give you the appropriate and correct advice.

So start at the beginning - what was the alleged credit account, what type of account was it, when was it taken out etc.

Next first date of default of alleged account

Next any attempts to resolve the alleged defaulted debt, letters sent, received and dates etc

Who was alleged debt assigned to and when, letters received and dates etc.

This will be really a beneficial exercise for you to go through and help get some perspective on things.

Best
SnV