Alternative cancer treatments

[Spent2much]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

I'm male, BUT I lose vast amounts of blood through coughing it up regularly every day. My physical health is pretty frail at times, so I am very well acquainted with GP's and especially hospitals.

thanks, sorry to hear about your health and yes conventional medicines do save lives no doubt , but i think this thread got lost somewhere as its really about alternative cancer treatments , but going back to the point i made about my doctor he just really never did his job properly that day and he should have known better because he knew i often got low on iron but was probably in a mood and lets face it doctors are human too and do have problems, but in my particular case he failed me and its only because my husband took me back on the evening surgery that he asked them for a blood test for me and the result was anemia.


I've read the above with interest, and there's not much more to say. Alternative medicine has its place, which I conceded near the start. Conventional medicine saves thousands of lives a year and is well proven.

Scepticism is healthy, but I have to disagree with one comment by Handy re. boosters being a further income stream.

maybe the boosters are a good thing but why put other dangerous things in too, personally i believe we are slowly being poisoned and i know some will say this far fetched , but its just how i see it.

This relates to dogs, but I guess the same principle applies to humans. My parents had a dog vaccinated against distemper. Foolishly they didn't keep up to date with the boosters and the dog died of distemper. The boosters must do something then.

Getting back to this case, your sister was clearly exceedingly ill, and no amount of medical intervention sadly, would have kept her alive. This must have been and must remain horrible for you. Don't write off conventional medicine though, and please don't put all your faith in alternative treatments.

My sister-in-law rcovered fully and her liver repaired itself but she sadly died from an asthama attack four years ago .

I believe an open mind, and informed balanced opinion is best. If 'clutching at straws' as well will do no harm, clutch them. I'll tell you, if I was offered a harmless alternative medicine to stop internal bleeding, I'd take it. I have faith in my medics, but it doesn't change the fact that for nearly 5 months I've been bleeding and at times passing out because of it, but they can find nothing. It just goes to show, however clever we think we are, our bodies will always throw something their way they can't understand or explain.

Have researched your condition and looked for alternative treatment ?
I hope you get well soon .

[BBoo]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

are you male or female ??

I'm male, BUT I lose vast amounts of blood through coughing it up regularly every day. My physical health is pretty frail at times, so I am very well acquainted with GP's and especially hospitals.

I've read the above with interest, and there's not much more to say. Alternative medicine has its place, which I conceded near the start. Conventional medicine saves thousands of lives a year and is well proven.

Scepticism is healthy, but I have to disagree with one comment by Handy re. boosters being a further income stream.

This relates to dogs, but I guess the same principle applies to humans. My parents had a dog vaccinated against distemper. Foolishly they didn't keep up to date with the boosters and the dog died of distemper. The boosters must do something then.

Getting back to this case, your sister was clearly exceedingly ill, and no amount of medical intervention sadly, would have kept her alive. This must have been and must remain horrible for you. Don't write off conventional medicine though, and please don't put all your faith in alternative treatments.

I believe an open mind, and informed balanced opinion is best. If 'clutching at straws' as well will do no harm, clutch them. I'll tell you, if I was offered a harmless alternative medicine to stop internal bleeding, I'd take it. I have faith in my medics, but it doesn't change the fact that for nearly 5 months I've been bleeding and at times passing out because of it, but they can find nothing. It just goes to show, however clever we think we are, our bodies will always throw something their way they can't understand or explain.

[Pixie]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

But to the point Science and the History of, should be taught at a young age. It can be made a fun and interesting subject. A little knowledge takes away a lot of Fear, and a little understanding goes a long way towards people being better able to look after themselves.

Regards to all, Handy

I'm trying my best...

[Handyman]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

For my CSE Biology Project many many years ago. I did a dissertation called the Fathers of Modern Medicine and yes, Edward Jenner was one of them.

What doesn't Kill me makes me stronger, is true when it comes to vaccination. The problem is what they put in the stuff, or the speed at which they can get the vaccine into the general population before the targeted Disease mutates.

I often wonder if the Big Pharmaceutical companies want their products to be totally effective. After all you only make money from people who are ill.

But to the point Science and the History of, should be taught at a young age. It can be made a fun and interesting subject. A little knowledge takes away a lot of Fear, and a little understanding goes a long way towards people being better able to look after themselves.

Regards to all, Handy

[ken100464]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

He certainly should be as he is taught about in Science in primary schools.

[Pixie]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

The man often regarded as saving the most lives is a fellow called Edward Jenner. Not a household name but he should be.

He certainly should be as he is taught about in Science in primary schools.

[ken100464]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Couple of things.

If inoculations have "cured" some deseases, why do we still need to be inoculated against it? no one to pass it on.

.

We need to maintain herd immunity.

There are only two diseases despite all of these vaccination programs that have been eradicated worldwide.

They are smallpox and rinderpest.

If we stopped vaccinated even in the west for things like mumps measles and rubella they would return as there are still resevoirs of the disease out there.

That can be seen by the MMR scandal. Parents withdrew their children from it and now the diseases are increasing due to the UK's herd immunity decreasing on all three.

All 3 are diseases that have been identified as candidates for worldwide eradication by WHO.

Its the herd immunity that stops them becoming epidemics.

No vaccine is 100% safe but they do it for the greater good. The risks and downsides for a few for the betterment of the many.

Thats a stark truth to confront. We all take a minute risk for the betterment of society. If we all stopped having vaccinations then an epidemic would occur as the herd immunity falls away.

We all rely on our neighbours and our neighbours children to be vaccinated and therefore protecting us and our children. They take this risk so I would always ask why should we not take that risk back?

Boosters are needed when a particular vaccine is not particularly effective.

In Polio they use oral live at present in endemic countries. Its more dangerous to the individual but more effective for the population.

Upon wild virus eradication then a non live strain will be used which is safer for the individual. Eventually when the world is Polio free then vaccination for it can stop.

Sorry for the long post but vaccination is so important for todays society.

The man often regarded as saving the most lives is a fellow called Edward Jenner. Not a household name but he should be.

[Spent2much]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Not sure what relevance Bboo's sex is?

i asked because usually women suffer aneamia and if he/she suffered heavy monthly cycles like i did and i bled for 21 days non stop so just asked as its easy to assume if you have never experienced before .

I've seen this from both sides, as a trained nurse and having nursed my husband with bowel and liver cancer for 5 years up to his death. I was unhappy with many aspects of his care but took issue with each concern at the time.

From a nursing aspect, TBH I've never ever known "Do not resuscitate" be written on a "medical sheet" by which I suppose you mean the chart hung on the bed?
yes and i certainly am not lying or over exaggerating , it was written because when she was admitted her liver kidneys were failing fast.

It's usually written as DNR within the medical notes folder (which is not seen by the patient or NOK unless specifically requested) and is a decision usually made after consultation with the patient or NOK if the patient isn't able. Not a decision to be taken lightly.
I had to make that call when my husband was bleeding from his bowel faster than they could transfuse him, after the cancer returned with a vengeance. The doctors talked to me and it was a joint decision with my sister in law to withold further transfusions as he was suffering so much and treatment was futile. We had to sign a form to this effect.
My brother her husband must have discussed it and agreed as she was
that bad.

You've obviously had some very bad experiences S2M, but to be fair without medical knowledge it's sometimes hard to understand what's really happening. Medical staff should be aware of this and explain to relatives in detail, but sadly this is not always the case I know.

I know and do appreciate that most medical staff want to do their best for patients , but as a family unfortuantely we have had bad experiences and we have had good ones. Such as my son with his elbow we couldn't fault that , but even then the day after his operation he and other patients on his ward had to shout out for help for my son because he pressed for help many times as the nurse had put the pain relief needle in his muscle instead of the vien and his arm was swelling up and was painful, they corrected it but the point here is that the night staff were incompetant and my son and the other patients said all the staff did were sit around laughing and being loud when patients were trying to sleep or needed help .

For instance, diabetics can go into hypoglycaemia very rapidly in response to infection, trauma or illness. When this happens, they can behave in a very uncharacteristic way.. eg become hypermanic, depressed, argumentative or even aggressive. Refusing help or medication could be a result of this.

I'm not saying this is what happened with your Aunt, but it is a possibility. I recall having to wrestle a patient away from trying to open and jump out of a third floor window when his glucose levels dropped dramatically when he had pneumonia. He was normally a lovely, polite man and couldn't remember much about it afterwards.
i know this happens but my auntie never refused medication and was only in for a stomach problem .

We all have our views and experiences and like i said my son received fantastic care from the surgeons on his elbow , but as i mentioned there were moments of neglect also .

generally medical staff do care and want to help, it isn't a job i could do as i can't stand the sight of blood .

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Not sure what relevance Bboo's sex is?

I've seen this from both sides, as a trained nurse and having nursed my husband with bowel and liver cancer for 5 years up to his death. I was unhappy with many aspects of his care but took issue with each concern at the time.

From a nursing aspect, TBH I've never ever known "Do not resuscitate" be written on a "medical sheet" by which I suppose you mean the chart hung on the bed?

It's usually written as DNR within the medical notes folder (which is not seen by the patient or NOK unless specifically requested) and is a decision usually made after consultation with the patient or NOK if the patient isn't able. Not a decision to be taken lightly.
I had to make that call when my husband was bleeding from his bowel faster than they could transfuse him, after the cancer returned with a vengeance. The doctors talked to me and it was a joint decision with my sister in law to withold further transfusions as he was suffering so much and treatment was futile. We had to sign a form to this effect.

You've obviously had some very bad experiences S2M, but to be fair without medical knowledge it's sometimes hard to understand what's really happening. Medical staff should be aware of this and explain to relatives in detail, but sadly this is not always the case I know.

For instance, diabetics can go into hypoglycaemia very rapidly in response to infection, trauma or illness. When this happens, they can behave in a very uncharacteristic way.. eg become hypermanic, depressed, argumentative or even aggressive. Refusing help or medication could be a result of this.

I'm not saying this is what happened with your Aunt, but it is a possibility. I recall having to wrestle a patient away from trying to open and jump out of a third floor window when his glucose levels dropped dramatically when he had pneumonia. He was normally a lovely, polite man and couldn't remember much about it afterwards.

[Spent2much]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

With all due respect, if you couldn't even walk, I find it hard to believe any doctor would say you were wasting his time. Even I would know there's something wrong with an able bodied person who suddenly loses the ability to walk.

are you male or female ??

my sister-in-law was going back to doctors for months before being admitted to hospital and dying , she was a green colour when we saw her a few days before and her doctor a different one at the same surgery said she was ok, she was dying and on her medical sheet it said 'do not resussitate' she pulled through with medication but died 4 years later aged 49 .

My 89 year old auntie was admitted to hospital with stomach pains as she was type 1 diabetic and of her age , she was fine the day before she died and was even talking the horses she had backed , the next day she was dead because they said she refused all medication , we know she would never do that she was always as bright as a button and took her medications religously. Even my mum says they killed her off .

[Handyman]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Hi SX, While I have been AWOL I have been looking at and trying to get my voice heard of several of the subjects you just mentioned.

Re: the Bicarb. The first tests were carried out in the US on Terminal Patients back @1908. There was some evidence of Shrinkage but Bicarb injected directly into the bloodstream can prove fatal.
There is some current research under way in the US I would have to go through all my notes to tell you which University is doing it (Salt Lake?).

Inoculations. Look at the conspiracy theorists re: UN Article 21.

But then ask why the Autism / MMR argument is starting to rear up again with new research in Primates. Because the main preservative in the Vaccine is Mercury, that and Antifreeze and a load of other Crap. Imagine if a link is ever proved the Billions in compensation against the Producers and the Government.

True at the moment there are stories on the net about people who have been inoculated catching the disease they were inoculated for. Therefore Booster Shots are required. Just another way for the Big Pharma to make more money is my opinion.

Re: The Liverpool Pathway. When Ma in Law was near the end her Doctor had a meeting with the Family to discuss her end of life plan. It was dignified and pain and fear free. At no time was she withheld Food or Water. She could have Oramorph when required, the only injection she received was for nausea. Indeed the Home made a bed room available to the Family FOC for ten days so we could take turns sitting with her.

Contrast this with the story of the Old Girl (much younger than MIL) who was admitted to an NHS Medicine for the Elderly Ward with a broken shoulder. Now the Last time I did first aid, a broken shoulder although painful in the extreme is not fatal.

This old Lass was put on the pathway without informing he next of kin. 3 days without water and on high doses of pain killer she passed away.

I posted several comments on this, then came the new that Heath Authorities were being paid a bonus for hitting the target of people they put on the Pathway.

I asked if this was state sponsored Euthanasia?

It now transpires there is to be an enquiry to see if any Doctor has overstepped the mark. More Governmental whitewash.

Sorry to go on. But at least now you know I haven't been idle while I have been away.

I wish I had taken the Blue Pill.

Regards all, Handy

[SXGuy]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Couple of things.

If inoculations have "cured" some deseases, why do we still need to be inoculated against it? no one to pass it on.

2nd, its strange how you say, some believe bicarb works while others believe its a load of toss, yet you decide to believe the latter and dismiss the former with no evidence or research of your own. Surely its best to sit on the fence in that situation.

3rd, im sure some of you have had great expierence with the NHS, but there are alot of who have not. and heres an example, 3 words, Liverpool, Care, Pathway.

[Handyman]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Actually, the idea that bicarbonate of soda can cure cancer was put forward by an Italian doctor, Dr. Tullio Simoncini. He has written a book entitled “Cancer is a fungus”, which details his theory. If you stick his name into the search engines, you will find much controversy, with many people saying he is the best thing since sliced bread, and others saying he is nothing but a quack. He was struck off by the Italian medical authorities who are not impressed with his claims.

I am unable to offer any opinion as I have absolutely no experience of the matter. I just mention this for the benefit of anyone who wants to carry out their own research.

SH

If you look around this link CLOSED -Hooray Hall. Adventures of a Handyman. - Page 54 - allaboutFORUMS Hooray Hall Adventures of A Handyman Pt1. You will see I have done a lot of Research on Mr Simonchi. Lady Hoorays Daughter has been treated by him at a cost of nearly 60K then she still had to go through Chemo back in the UK. Beware the Alternative Medicines Market. They are worth millions a year and some of the operators are as corrupt as the big pharma companies.

I agree that in some recent research Bicarb has shown some promising results. I also believe that there are cures out there that only need a few million to test and would cost pennies to produce. But they can't get the funding to get it through the FDA, because the big companies can't make money unless they can get a patent.

But Please beware Tulio Simonchini until you research him fully. He was a Doctor for the Italian DWP before he was struck off and jailed. He only does treatment in Serbia and South Africa. His Serbian Surgeon took one look at Lady H's daughter and did a full Mastectomy. She could have had it her on her BUPA policy but instead 40K to Simonchini for 1 consultation and 20K for the OP.

Regards, Handy

[BBoo]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

i suppose it depends on the quality of treatment one gets, i know i have been let down many times especailly once when i so aneamic i couldn't even walk, my doctor said i was wasting his time as i was just being anxious

With all due respect, if you couldn't even walk, I find it hard to believe any doctor would say you were wasting his time. Even I would know there's something wrong with an able bodied person who suddenly loses the ability to walk.

[ken100464]

Re: Alternative cancer treatments

Smallpox, polio, whooping cough, rubella, TB

I have been following the eradication of Polio for a number of years now. The interest comes from my job.

They are now on the cusp of making this terrible disease extinct.

This year there has been 188 cases in 4 countries of which only 3 are classed as endemic. One day soon this will be a news story like the erradication of smallpox.

Only a few years ago 250,000 per year were being maimed.

They have a strain of Polio that is derived from the vaccine and also maims but to wipe out the wild virus first is a goal worth the risk.

Herd immunity is what vaccination is about. It sadly doesnt always work but without it the situation would be much much worse.

Cancer is rightly an emotive subject. I doubt there is any right or wrongs just different ways. Sometimes the patients state of mind is key. Sometimes a placebo will do more good than an aggresive medicine or intervention.

Without experimentation cures will not be found. There are many diseases that due to medical science are close to being cured. Many cancers researchers are starting to say will be curable within many of our lifetimes.

How do I know on this last point. Just been there and just lost my mum. You try and learn as much as you can in order to give and get hope as a loved one slips away.