Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Fingers crossed for you P1!

More painful sorting through last couple of days, then I've spoken with my sister and told it's way too complex to DIY, so we've agreed to go to a solicitor. Sister will do the phoning stuff and I'll do the paperwork. We figure mum was paying approx £500 pm for 3 yrs.
She's spoken to sols who are sending a questionaire out. They said we've still got time. I gave her a list of questions one of which was how is the CFA paid...from the reclaimed fees or via costs awarded in court. It comes out of the reclaimed amount at 18% + VAT. They said it rarely gets to court, they usually settle.
Interest is payable in two tiers.

And so it begins...

Looks like we'll be holding hands in cyber-space with this one then Shep...erm...Elsa ...

The fact that interest is added to the re-claim balances things up a bit in terms of the fees they charge and, it takes the headache out of going it alone.

Keep us all posted.... and I will do the same.

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Fingers crossed for you P1!

More painful sorting through last couple of days, then I've spoken with my sister and told it's way too complex to DIY, so we've agreed to go to a solicitor. Sister will do the phoning stuff and I'll do the paperwork. We figure mum was paying approx £500 pm for 3 yrs.
She's spoken to sols who are sending a questionaire out. They said we've still got time. I gave her a list of questions one of which was how is the CFA paid...from the reclaimed fees or via costs awarded in court. It comes out of the reclaimed amount at 18% + VAT. They said it rarely gets to court, they usually settle.
Interest is payable in two tiers.

And so it begins...

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

I suppose that's where the solicitors' expertise will come in as when they're used to dealing with these cases they'll know what to pick out from the careplans to highlight.
Has it been confirmed that she actually had a proper continuing care assessment?

That's also my thinking... Due to the deadline, I can't afford to cock it up by focussing on the wrong thing(s) or, not focussing enough on the right thing(s) and, as it's going to form part of a legal claim eventually.... it needs to be spot on.

I'm not sure whether she had a proper continuing care assessment or not, to be honest. The paperwork from the home included references to the categories within a continuing care assessment but it may not have been proper bona fide assessment(s), as such. The solicitor seems hopeful (for now anyway) and has told me that because the paperwork is extensive, there's a lot of support in there for the claim.

It cost me around £7 (normal postage) to send it all off, so you can imagine what he's got to plough through. There was no need to send it recorded delivery, as I had copied the whole lot at work anyway.... just in case anyone was wondering.... ....

Once he's ploughed through the whole lot though and extracted what he needs, the claim will then be lodged with the Primary Care Trust.

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

I suppose that's where the solicitors' expertise will come in as when they're used to dealing with these cases they'll know what to pick out from the careplans to highlight.
Has it been confirmed that she actually had a proper continuing care assessment?

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Continuing health care is defined as:

‘Care provided over an extended period of time, to a person aged 18 or over to meet physical or mental health needs that have arisen as a result of disability, accident or illness.’

It's not as straightforward to answer as the above statement implies however. It has to be established that a person has a primary healthcare need and needs associated with that condition are then graded from severe downwards. Needs include cognition, behaviour, psych/emotional, nutrition, breathing and so on. I can't remember them all... but you get the idea.

I've only had a quick glance for the moment but the care home records for Mum did grade her needs under these type of headings, so I'm assuming this was part of an assessment taken from time to time. Although her primary care need was Alzheimer's.... some people with it still don't qualify which confuses the whole issue.

It's all a bit of a... No wonder people give up. It also looks as if you have to very specific when answering questions to make sure that certain criteria is covered or the claim might fail.

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Too true!

As I don't want to hijack your thread P1, am I Ok to keep posting on here to share experiences/info or should I start my own. I don't mind which.

For your reference, I found these..a really good guide by the Alzheimers Society, and a copy of the NHS Continuing care check list...

Of course it is hun.... I think it helps to share experiences like this.

Thank you for those links as well.... I'll take a look.

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Too true!

As I don't want to hijack your thread P1, am I Ok to keep posting on here to share experiences/info or should I start my own. I don't mind which.

For your reference, I found these..a really good guide by the Alzheimers Society, and a copy of the NHS Continuing care check list...

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Did the care home charge you for the records, P1? (I suppose it's classed as a SAR)

I've just been searching my backup drive for info..very painful. The reason she went downhill so quickly was the stress of dealing with my stepfathers death 2 years before. They were devoted and he never saw his extended family for years. My sister and I were his carers. As soon as he became seriously ill and went in a care home himself while Mum was still at home, random grandsons suddenly appeared and velcroed themselves to his bedside. They thought they smelled money. They managed to turn this confused, dying old chap away from his wife of 25 years for a time, were rude and nasty to her when she visited, she could never see him alone, and tried to take over his financial affairs. They accused her of spending his money, even tried to take away a solid gold id bracelet my mum had bought him. They didn't realise the house was in my mum's name, willed to us, and he'd signed an affadavit years ago stating he'd no financial interest in the house as it was bought with our family money. Eventually the nursing home staff offered to ban them after we physically had to guard the door so Mum and him could have privacy to cuddle and hold hands and sob and she put him straight on what his so called family had been up to. Horrendous.

Ironic thing is...I now have all his records, if they ever wanted to claim his care home fees they'd have to come through me.
There is justice.

There was no charge for the records Shep, no.... although the request was made by the company/solicitor, which may have made a difference. I think I offered to pay for photocopying though.... I know it crossed my mind at the time anyway.... but they didn't asked for anything.

It is very painful when thinking about the past... I do feel for you there and can relate to it as well. My mum had far too much bereavement in her life and I don't think she ever fully recovered from losing my dad. Although he'd been ill for a number of years, his death was sudden and her behaviour deteriorated from that point on, to be honest.

Relatives often come out of the woodwork when they smell money.... your experience sounds horrendous! These people have to live with themselves though and usually, karma works her magic very nicely in the end.

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Just been checking..the solicitors on the TV with Dom Littlewood were Hugh James. I might enquire with them first, see if the think we've a claim.

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Did the care home charge you for the records, P1? (I suppose it's classed as a SAR)

I've just been searching my backup drive for info..very painful. The reason she went downhill so quickly was the stress of dealing with my stepfathers death 2 years before. They were devoted and he never saw his extended family for years. My sister and I were his carers. As soon as he became seriously ill and went in a care home himself while Mum was still at home, random grandsons suddenly appeared and velcroed themselves to his bedside. They thought they smelled money. They managed to turn this confused, dying old chap away from his wife of 25 years for a time, were rude and nasty to her when she visited, she could never see him alone, and tried to take over his financial affairs. They accused her of spending his money, even tried to take away a solid gold id bracelet my mum had bought him. They didn't realise the house was in my mum's name, willed to us, and he'd signed an affadavit years ago stating he'd no financial interest in the house as it was bought with our family money. Eventually the nursing home staff offered to ban them after we physically had to guard the door so Mum and him could have privacy to cuddle and hold hands and sob and she put him straight on what his so called family had been up to. Horrendous.

Ironic thing is...I now have all his records, if they ever wanted to claim his care home fees they'd have to come through me.
There is justice.

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Excellent! Hope it all goes smoothly for you hun. Is interest payable on the refund?

I need to do some more digging about this today as time is running out, as is my memory of events! Part of the paperwork is here and part with my sister 70 miles away so going to be a bit of a faff, but hopefully worth it in the end. She was also in 2 different nursing homes and changed counties when she moved so different authorities. Her GP was changed to the ones attached to the nursing homes too, so that might prove tricky.

Bloody hell Shep... interest never even crossed my mind!! I'll remember to bring that up with the company/solicitor handling it as things progress. Thank you!

You do need to act fast yourself though Shep.... I know the cut-off is the end of September but as the chap handling things for me explained yesterday, it takes time to trawl through the paperwork and find the evidence to support the claim and make it strong. Those care home records are the key and as they are spread all over the place in your case, it will take a while to bring together all the information you need and plough through it all.

First thing would be to contact both homes and ask for copies of all care records. This could take a while or it might not. The chap dealing with this for me said that homes are often reluctant/slow to do this but in my case, they were very quick and very helpful. I came out of there with a huge bundle but Mum had been in there for 5 years, so I suppose that explains things. It must have taken them ages to copy it all for me!

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

Excellent! Hope it all goes smoothly for you hun. Is interest payable on the refund?

I need to do some more digging about this today as time is running out, as is my memory of events! Part of the paperwork is here and part with my sister 70 miles away so going to be a bit of a faff, but hopefully worth it in the end. She was also in 2 different nursing homes and changed counties when she moved so different authorities. Her GP was changed to the ones attached to the nursing homes too, so that might prove tricky.

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

**Update**

The company dealing with the claim have said that because Mum's care home records are supportive.... and because they are so extensive (a good thing), it's going to take some time to formulate the claim before lodging it with the PCT.

Plenty of time to do that before the September deadline though.... and it's looking good at the moment.

[PriorityOne]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

As far as I remember we didn't need a grant of probate...there was a will with just me and my sister as beneficiaries and excecutors so it was quite straight forward.
Her house had been sold a few years before, part of the money being used to build a granny flat at my sisters. She was only in it 18 months before she started having hallucinations and wandering in the street. One day she invited a gypsy woman in for tea! Bless her.

The solicitor was Executor of the Will in my case.... long story..... so your case might be easier from that viewpoint.

I can relate to the wanderings.... my Mum used to wander and it was a huge worry as there are con artists out there who prey on the vulnerable. My mum would have invited all and sundry in for tea.... I hate to imagine what could have happened!!

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Dementia.... re-claiming care home fees.

As far as I remember we didn't need a grant of probate...there was a will with just me and my sister as beneficiaries and excecutors so it was quite straight forward.
Her house had been sold a few years before, part of the money being used to build a granny flat at my sisters. She was only in it 18 months before she started having hallucinations and wandering in the street. One day she invited a gypsy woman in for tea! Bless her.