Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Yes its late lol, but put something together. Okay its VERY lengthy, as wasnt sure to write some points first then about the compo etc, it maybe too much I dont know LOL. I can of course change it, take out non relevant info if you dont think its needed. :-)

DRAFT!!!!

.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ................

For the attention of The Service Manager (Name)


Complaint REF xxxxxxxxxx


We are writing to you about the disappointing service received from the Financial Ombudsman Service.

We made our complaint about Lloyds Bank PLC in August 2012, as it was rejected we raised this up with the Financial Ombudsman Service.

Firstly, we would like to show details of what happened whilst our complaint was under the team of Adjudicators (please note these are not all emails, but relevant in order to give you an idea of what we have been going through) later in this letter, it will explain why we feel we have reason to raise this up with you.


Our case was finally allocated to the "First Adjudicator (name)" on 22 May 2013, on request we sent a number of information that was relevant to our complaint, sent by many emails.


On the 10th July 2013, we received an email from (Adjudicator) she recommended not to uphold, but in order to review again for us to send further information by 24 July 2013. We sent further information in order to have our complaint reviewed.


Email received 13 August 2013, (Adjudicator) now recommends to uphold and confirmed she had written to Lloyds.


We had emailed later on to ask for any updates and further developments, ie: from Lloyds Bank.


An email received from (Adjudicator) dated 29 August 2013, Adjudicator stated she spoken to Lloyds who had explained a fault with the systems about letter she sent them, and Lloyds state it was only logged the day before (28 August 2013) so Lloyds were given extra time - for the end of that week.

31 August 2013 we raised comments about missed points and it was said that the Adjudicator was also to take matter up with Senior Colleague, this was in regards of her upheld decision made in August 2013.
We heard nothing more on her Senior Manager, so not even sure if it was actually taken up or not.


Meanwhile we emailed for updates and received an email from Adjudicator to state she in process of reviewing information and needed more time as it was complex in regards of some calculations of rates etc.

We also sent further information, as it appeared Lloyds could not provide all the information.


An opinion was made on our complaint dated 30 October 2013 sent by email - Not upheld. Hard=Copy also arrived in the post some days later.

Since them there were many other emails and information sent, and we received emails about the delays in responding to us and that the FOS had problems with the Systems 04/11/2013 and it was said emails to us kept getting blocked.
A further email 18 November 2013 about delays and hoped to review our complaint by the end of that week.
On the 21 November 2013, the decision arrived and again it was unchanged and to reject.

On that same day of 21 November 2013, we emailed to confirm that we did not agree with the decision and to have our complaint passed to the Ombudsman, we also requested for fast track due to illness conditions, one of those can be life threatening if not kept in control, Chronic Kidney Disease (CKD) which is a progressing disease and high blood pressure. Being under hospital specialist for this chronic illness, blood pressure has to be in control, any stress can cause a raise in blood pressure and highly possible further damage to the kidneys, unfortunately, it is the blood pressure that caused the kidney disease. We also have an Autistic son with special needs that require a lot of our time and attention, all this was disclosed to the Adjudicator.

We were informed that under exceptional serious circumstances, illness and/or hardship are taken into account to be eligible for fast tracking and that our individual case will be discussed with a Senior Manager.
On the 22 November we received an email to confirm they will fast track due to our circumstances and again on the 13 December 2013 informed that our complaint was agreed for fast track for a number of reasons.

We were informed that our file will be passed to the Ombudsman by the 18 December 2013 and also to forward any further information by that time, but as this did not happen for that date we queried this on 6 Jan 2014, the Adjudicator said she will make Ombudsman aware that our complaint was to be treated as priority, and later that day it was confirmed our file was finally passed on (5 Jan 2014).

8 February 2014, a response to our email to ask for an approximate timescale, but was informed it will inevitable take a bit of time.

21 February 2014, Update of our complaint, Ombudsman requested for information from Lloyds and Adjudicator Ms Fiona Jarrold confirmed she leaving business and our complaint was passed on to her colleague Mr Jonas Carboo-Brown.

Since this changeover, there were many emails, and further information submitted and again further delays.

We raised some concerns on email dated 15 April 2014 to Adjudicator Mr Jonas Carboo-Brown, this was also due to more missed points on received emails from previous weeks, we said that we are going round in circles and also of the discomfort of lack of diligence in picking up the main crux of our complaint.
We received on 17 April 2014 in response to our email to explain it understood this is a difficult situation for us, and the amount of information, time and our effort we put into it.
With that they were fully aware by then how stressful this was for us!
We also indicated that we are considering putting in a complaint about the service of our complaint and in response to this, the Adjudicator said to let him know if we require the details to make this complaint.

On the 25 April 2014 we received an email to confirm the Ombudsman will be reviewing our complaint, as prior to this we had sent them yet more further information.
They could not provide any timescale but then on the 23 May 2014 we received the Provisional decision by email, it was "upheld in part" but no further award of compensation for distress/inconvenience/delays etc was awarded.
However, it was also confirmed that now this Adjudicator Mr Jonas Carboo-Brown was leaving the business that day, and our complaint was being passed to his colleague Mr Alex Chruscikowski. Please note and take into account this is the "3rd Adjudicator" and if we could send in further submissions for a final decision by the 24 June 2014.

We had done this by sending in further information, as it was clear as stated on a comment made by the Ombudsman on the provisional decision that Lloyds could not provide the relevant information, and we also sent a letter/email for the final submission, we made it clear of the way our complaint had been dealt with throughout and requested for compensation for the distress/inconvenience it caused us, but on the 26 June 2014, the Final decision was unchanged to still "uphold in part" and no award of compensation for the above stated reasons.

It appears that the Ombudsman didn't think it would be appropriate in the circumstances of the complaint, she states our frustration but nothing at all about our health matters which surely she should have been clearly aware of this (reasons for fast track).
We have been affected in all ways, firstly it does not help that fact there are already serious health conditions, stress or delays does not help. Its caused pain and suffering.
It's been like a game of pass the parcel where there was no full ownership to just one Adjudicator changing staff, information after information was submitted as requested, yet very essential information was missed and not taken into account, what we did provide felt it was used against us and it concerns us that it seemed to be just one sided and not impartial, considering lack of information provided by the bank, yet they used just basic non concrete information from the bank as a back up for them to make it seem we made ours up, despite sending in a huge amount of paperwork, this was also confirmed of us doing this and our efforts by Mr Jonas Carboo-Brown on one of his emails above.
This is shocking behaviour and like a roller-coaster ride, it just went downhill, we do not feel we have had fair treatment, it feels more like torture, we have enough of that treatment already from these banks.

We hope you can also refer to the final letter used during submissions for the final decision, as you will see in more details and previous emails too.

We hope this can be looked into, as we feel it is essential to have this put right. We look forward to hearing from you.


Yours sincerely,

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

I'll catch up later. Sorry been manic today. Sit tight. No rush this weekend. Let me see what you've already done.

The Ind Assessor is last resort. For now it's a complaint to service manager.

Not a problem Niddy, I have only just made another start, had fuzzy head so rested it. I will get this posted up over the weekend, hope thats ok? lol Thanks.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

I'll catch up later. Sorry been manic today. Sit tight. No rush this weekend. Let me see what you've already done.

The Ind Assessor is last resort. For now it's a complaint to service manager.

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

So the first step is write to the Service Manager (was given email details for this), they have up to 20 days, if still not happy can take it to the IA by 3 months of the outcome of the Senior Manager?

Had a busy day today, so will probably make a start later or so, just to get it off my back lol.

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

What a shocking roller-coaster ride you've had at the hands of the FOS especially when one Adjudicator was minded to uphold your whole complaint and it then went downhill all the way after that when they started to play pass-the-parcel with your case.

Making a forceful complaint will at least give you the satisfaction that those responsible for this shoddy service will get a telling-off. I once took a complaint of poor service direct to the Operations Manager and he authorised a compensation payment of £400 to match what I would have got from the firm if the FOS hadn't taken so long to deal with it that the firm went bust in the meantime.

You can take your complaint all the way to the Independent Assessor who is very much independent. She's not in the same building and doesn't share the same email account etc. I took my complaint to her over a Mortgage Express case which the FOS did actually uphold in my favour and I got £8k refunded to my mortgage. The problem was the FOS didn't tell me that by accepting their Decision I lost the opportunity to take the Mortgage Express to court for consequential loss. The IA upheld my complaint about the FOS.

She can award compensation for the FOS' poor service and frequently does: http://www.independent-assessor.org.uk/

Thank you PlanB
My gosh sorry to hear of your own experience with them and glad you had this resolved.
Thank you for this information as well, i appreciate this.
Once I have something going on in my head, i must deal with it there and then, I am rather highly strung, always have been, but yes its been shoddy alright.

I can recall some years ago having one or 2 dealings with the FOS and then it wasnt as bad, but these recent years it seems they do anything to back the banks, I think this bad behaviour has all got worse since that judical review, as if they felt sorry for these banks!

I could have done without this type of behaviour on this one mind, back and forth hospital and dr's for my health conds etc, its take its toll and I feel the need to get this off my chest for the satisfaction of it.

I was actually reading through some of the final decisions made on the FOS website, and this particular one that dealt with my case never seems to overturn decisions.
Okay it was finally part upheld and better than nothing, but its the principal of it now.

Again thanks for this as well PlanB.
I admit, I would have fell apart by now if it wasnt for Niddy and you great folks, so I do have a lot to be thankful for, in having this suppot from you all, thank you so much xxx

[PlanB]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

If I decide to write to the Service Manager, from what i know of you can still do this even if you accept, as the whole point here now is the service of the complaint.

. . . there was also a time the "first adjudicator" recommend to uphold the whole complaint, it was changed back to not uphold again and the fact of having 3 different adjudicators and repeating ourselves etc......

What a shocking roller-coaster ride you've had at the hands of the FOS especially when one Adjudicator was minded to uphold your whole complaint and it then went downhill all the way after that when they started to play pass-the-parcel with your case.

Making a forceful complaint will at least give you the satisfaction that those responsible for this shoddy service will get a telling-off. I once took a complaint of poor service direct to the Operations Manager and he authorised a compensation payment of £400 to match what I would have got from the firm if the FOS hadn't taken so long to deal with it that the firm went bust in the meantime.

You can take your complaint all the way to the Independent Assessor who is very much independent. She's not in the same building and doesn't share the same email account etc. I took my complaint to her over a Mortgage Express case which the FOS did actually uphold in my favour and I got £8k refunded to my mortgage. The problem was the FOS didn't tell me that by accepting their Decision I lost the opportunity to take the Mortgage Express to court for consequential loss. The IA upheld my complaint about the FOS.

She can award compensation for the FOS' poor service and frequently does: http://www.independent-assessor.org.uk/

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Thank you Niddy :-)

Not sure what you think of what I did write yesterday in above post, maybe i need to make it stronger, never been this far before lol.

I have sent signed form to accept and they have just emailed back to say, its now binding on us and the bank, and if nothing heard by 4 weeks to contact the adjudicator.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Well not much we can do there sadly, ok so you need to look at completing a complaint about the service overall. This must detail how it's affected you, the unnecessary delays, the way they've changed staff all the time mid-discussion, the way things have been missed as a result of all the staff changes, nobody taking ownership of the complaint, seemingly being biased to Natwest (ie you had to provide everything and even when you did the FOS pushed for more and more which affected your health/stress)

You get the idea, don't whine about the case - you are specifically arguing about the way you have been treated by the FOS and how this treatment has affected you and your health.

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Dear Mr & Mrs

Thank you for your email. I am afraid that I comment any further on your request for compensation as the investigation is now closed with the issue of the final decision.

Email is a perfectly acceptable way of providing this so please don’t worry about forwarding a hard copy.

Yours sincerely,

A

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Received email back from Adjudicator about he compo being overlooked, looks like he's missed the point!! muppet!!!

Dear Mr & Mrs

Thank you for your email. The issue of compensation was addressed by the Ombudsman on the second page of the final decision, in the third paragraph of the section titled “my findings”.

Do let me know if you have any other queries.

Yours sincerely,

A

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

We'll pick this up tmw.

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

lol no i wont send anything yet, just wanted to write some ideas of what to write when the time comes lol....... So it reminds me.....( dont think they will get back to be honest on the question I sent them about overlooking on compo) going by letter they do not discuss anything after final decision been given, usually that adjudicator gets back immediately, we shall see if he gets back soon then lol.

cheers again

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

R-reading it again. I dont think they will get back to that question, because the letter does state they are not allowed to give details of the complaint, but can only discuss about accepting the decision or rejecting.......

Just copied and pasted this from an email weeks ago when asking for details to complain about their service below but can i still accept and complain about the service, surely that is separate?

Dear Mr & Mrs

Further to my last email I have attached a leaflet with information regarding our complaints process.
The first point of call would be my manager, Lisa Lowe, who is available on 02070935702 or lisa.lowe@financial-ombudsman.org.uk. Lisa can look at the service you have received, but not at the outcome of the complaint as that is strictly down to the Ombudsman.
Yours sincerely,
Adjudicator

You have 6 months. Same as you do with a financial institution.

Slow down. I've not even read the letter yet. Just chillax.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

Woah. You really need to relax. You do have time to digest. Think. Await replies.

Slooooooooow right down and don't do anything rash.

[di30]

Re: Not too good news with my packaged reclaim/FOS

For the attention of the Service Manager (Name)

We are writing to you in regards of our complaint REF no xxxxxxxxx

We taken our complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service (date) and we have just received the Final Decision from the Ombudsman dated 26/06/2014.
The whole process has been most stressful, and we believe our complaint has been overlooked.

We have been passed from one Adjudicator to another, we have had 3 dealing with our complaint not including the Ombudsman. We have had to provide information on top of information on each one. We know submitting information is all part of the process of our complaint, but its been excessive, as we have gone out of our way and made a big effort in trying to prove our case. (Unlike the bank) where the Ombudsman has clearly made her decision by lack of their evidence.

When it came to the first Adjudicator (Name), at first she decided not to uphold our complaint, so we were given the opportunity to put forward our points, which then gave her the opinion to recommend to uphold the complaint, but later she changed her mind again and decided to not uphold.
With that, we had the opportunity to forward our complaint to the Ombudsman, we agreed to do this and requested for fast tracking due to Medical reasons, this was accepted as we were also made aware prior to that - that they will only consider fast track in exceptional circumstances, and because of what was disclosed of the medical conditions it was agreed we could have fast track.
This was almost 5 months ago (We were not under fast track prior to our complaint going to the Adjudicator, but only when taking it to the Ombudsman).

However, since then, the first Adjudicator left the business and we were under another named Mr XXXXXX XXXXXX, we were requested to send in further information, and he had also emailed to confirm he understands the efforts we made in sending all information we held relevant to our case.

Since then, we received the Provisional decision and also informed Mr XXXXX XXXXXXX the Adjudicator was leaving the business and we were yet under a new Adjudicator, this was the 3rd.
We forwarded further information as requested on the Provisional decision as we were not happy with the full outcome. We were not happy on the way the complaint had been dealt with from start to finish and also raised this with the Adjudicator and requested details of the Service Manager whilst submitting the final information, it is explained on the final submission due to the service of how our complaint been dealt with, and since nothing has changed since receiving our final decision, such as important relevant points missed, our complaint have been overlooked and for the request of further redress for Distress, upset, anxiety, stress, this has caused much inconvenience which includes our time spent on the case and the efforts made, despite not being well dealing with this.

It has been raised that one of us has Chronic Kidney Disease (CKD) and High Blood Pressure, also under a Hospital Nephrologist (specialist) for care of these conditions and to stay stress free and to avoid further stress to the kidneys, high blood pressure is the cause of the kidney disease and any further stress can cause further damage which can be life threatening.
This has taken a toll on us both, as one of us was also treated for depresssion issues also treated with medication, and trying to avoid going down that road again.

We have suffered tremendously on trying to get this resolved, our time and effort, and the inconvenience this has caused us much distress, but going by the Ombudsman's final decision it seems this part of our submission was not important to take into account, despite being aware of these issues, yet we have checked on your website and it appears that we do fit these categories, but we have been failed on this.

We understand you will look into these matters, we will appreciate you looking into this and let us know what your views are on this matter. If you do require anything further, please email me on...............
Although its understood you use the information we already submitted and details of the Ombudsman's decisions.

We look forward to hearing from you.


Yours sincerely,


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This is just a rough draft! Should I add more and/or make it stronger? (never been this far before)? lol cheers x