PPI/Unenforcability

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Thanks Di

I'll give you a shout when we're ready - not yet

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

As I've said before - absolute no rush, just when you have the time. Again, thanks.

C

[di30]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Thanks Di

I'll give you a shout when we're ready - not yet

Yeah ok Niddy LOL, will be waiting! LOL

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Hiya

Ok, had an in depth look. So, your current loan - lets look into this in more detail..... Please answer the points in blue for me - thanks

1. The agreement you sent me, is this your copy or a copy sent from the bank in response to a SAR and/or CCA Request?
2. The loan, can you clarify at the time you started it what was you doing, ie were you working and if so did you have any sickness policy through work or anything like that? Also, had you in the last 3 years prior to starting the loan ever had any hospital treatment or anything they would consider as "existing illness"?
3. You applied for a loan of £10775 to pay off an existing loan for the value of £6187 - this loan at £6187, did it have optional PPI insurance?

What I have found are a few issues really, so it's looking better for you but now you need to rack your brain and try and answer the following, if you can't - no worries, just means we need to go get a SAR to get info on the closed accounts. Ok, so based on the agreement you emailed me I notice;

PART 1 - KEY FINANCIAL INFO

1. Loan amount is for £10,775
2. £6187.45 to refinance old loan
3. £2,212.55 balance goes to you
4. Insurance loan was £2,375

Total = £10,775

Ok so part 2 then mentiones the PPI

(c) - total amount payable = £14,196.00 (Includes £3129.60 insurance)

1. £3421.00 interest includes £754.60 for insurance loan

Ok now where I have a problem is the actual figures, try as you will - they are not adding up even if you take out part 2 altogether in which case you'd end up with £6187.45 + £2212.55 + £2375 = £10,775 (+ interest as £3129.60) = £13,904.60

However if you then ignore this interest charge and instead look at the interest shown in the base (part 2) this shows a total charge as £3,421 - which if you add this to the current loan amount of £10,775 you then get the figure £14,196 as per their claim within "Total amount Payable".

Basically this agreement is incorrect and is therefore unenforceable. How weird, it's actually a right mess so really you now hold much stronger cards in which to negotiate.

So what is the best way to go from here? personally, I would look at getting all info they hold about you including data on all closed loans. So I need you to confirm the following please:

1. Have you sent off a SAR and if so what data have they sent you, ie have they sent statements for all accounts, even those closed ones?

I'll come back to you later but basically this is a wee bit of a mess and needs a lot of work, do I have the time to sit and fight it for you? Honestly, no. However it's easy for you to do if you start listening to me and actually responding to things when I ask - please, no emails/print outs etc - they do not help me at all right now.

Please answer the above and i'll then come back to you, but I need to know if you have done a SAR (I know we've mentioned this before but I need reminding) - and if so what did they send you within it?

Thanks - chat soon

[diddlydee]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Here is how I read the breakdown, using the figures given:

Interest on loan = £2666.40 (ie. £3421 total minus interest of £754.60 for PPI)*
Loan total = £8400.00 (ie. £6187.45 refinance plus £2212.55 balance)
PPI figure = £2375.00 (added to loan)
Interest on PPI = £754.60**

Total borrowed = £14196.00 (fig. C(1))



*What they haven't done is given a separate figure for interest on the loan, only an amalgamated amount of interest for the loan & PPI together

** Total PPI of £3129.60 to include interest

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Diddly there is a missing £291.40 somewhere...... the yellow total vs the red total. In any case the sums are wrong and they cannot merge interest like this..... it's just wrong, yea if you add up the PPI + Interest on PPi then you do get £3129.60 but they've listed this above as a separate interest entry showing "£3421" which gives a shortfall of £291.40...

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

*What they haven't done is given a separate figure for interest on the loan, only an amalgamated amount of interest for the loan & PPI together

Exactly and this makes it unenforceable under s.18 CCA1974.

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Diddly there is a missing £291.40 somewhere...... the yellow total vs the red total. In any case the sums are wrong and they cannot merge interest like this..... it's just wrong, yea if you add up the PPI + Interest on PPi then you do get £3129.60 but they've listed this above as a separate interest entry showing "£3421" which gives a shortfall of £291.40...

Just to point out, Diddly explained that basically the £3421 figure on the thread is the interest total - of which £754.60 is interest on PPI and £2666.40 is interest on loan.

The £3129.60 figure is total PPI (£2375.00) to include interest from above (£754.60).

There is no "missing" £291.40 as the two figures of £3421 and £3129.60 relate to different things.

It is confusing, but, other than the fact that they haven't fully broken down the interest on the loan "v" the PPI (other than to say £3421 total of which £754.60 is PPI interest) all other figures do add up.

Thanks diddly

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Answers :

1. This my copy from when loan was orignally taken out.

2. I was off work sick from 1998 to 2004 with a chronic condition. i started work in 2004. came off work late 2006 but was on ssp until early 2007 when I came off work competely. I came off work with the same condition. I did not have any insurance with employer or anyone else. I did make a claim on the ppi which they paid out for one or two months then they wrote to me and told me that the payment(s) was a mistake (although they did not ask for it back), and I would be receiving no further payments under the PPI.

3. The existing loan of £6187 did have PPI on it. There was also a loan before that which also had PPI on it. In each case I was not asked about pre-existing conditions and was told that I was more likely be accepted for each loan if I took out the PPI.

4.

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

4. I sent a SARS letter off on the 28 November 2011, with the relevant £10, asking for all information regarding all loans/overdrafts etc and have heard nothing back from them yet. I believe they have 40 working days.

I hope this answers all your questions. If you need anything else just let me know.

Many thanks

C

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

4. I sent a SARS letter off on the 28 November 2011, with the relevant £10, asking for all information regarding all loans/overdrafts etc and have heard nothing back from them yet. I believe they have 40 working days.

I hope this answers all your questions. If you need anything else just let me know.

Many thanks

C

Hiya

Awesome, thanks for this - makes crystal clear sense. Ok, we need to await SAR stuff now - when it comes please PM/E-Mail me and then i'll go through things with you - it will get complicated so if you're happy with it, I'll do most this for you and all you have to do is provide the answers to the questions I'll ask and then copy/paste the letters onto a word document, print and post

Obviously nearer the reclaim time we'll then get Di30 involved etc to help out as required as she's shit-hot at reclaims. However I'm gonna try and attack them using unenforceability and the missale of insurance premiums, see if we can't get this whole lot written off but first we need to check if you're better off reclaiming or not - so until the SAR data arrives, we're kinda at standstill.

happy? Any questions, concerns or queries? Fire away - am all ears

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

If you're happy then I'm happy! Sorry it took a lot of messing about/confusion to get to this stage. Your help and patience has been invaluable.

As soon as I hear anything from them I will contact you and/or will put the date in the diary for when the deadline is up and then contact you then about where to go from there.

Once again, many thanks to you and your colleagues.

C

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Catell - you're welcome.

Just remember, although you may be due a repayment we want to try and kill everything so it's finished once and for all, so yea whilst I'd love to get you £5k in your bank, I don't see this happening, however we will get you some cash - how much depends on what comes in the SAR but at the very least we'll be reclaiming for the settled 3 loans which span back several years so adding 8% to all monthly premiums will work out to be a good little windfall for you.

More later, just relax and enjoy your Christmas yea? That's a Niddy order!

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Hey, although a few quid in my bank would be great it would just be lovely to be debt free and not having them phone me all the time asking if my circumstances have changed/can i pay anymore etc etc.

You and all your little helpers have a great xmas too.

C

[Catell]

Re: PPI/Unenforcability

Hi all, firstly I would like to wish you all a belated Happy New Year.

Before this site was recommended to me and I received the correct advice I sent of a CCA letter (was advised to do so by another site). I have now received a reply to this letter which includes a a copy of the Credit Agreement (illegible but signed and dated), a copy Insurance Certificate and a Schedule of Arrears.

On the advice of Niddy & Co I sent off a SARS letter late November but have yet to receive a reply. Not having a chequebook I send a £10 postal order, never kept the receipt and now have no way of knowing if it has been cashed or not.

Anyway, my question is, is it worth letting you have sight of the docs received in relation to the CCA letter or shall I just wait until I receive response to the SARS letter?

Thanks for reading.

C x