XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

[Never-In-Doubt]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

PlanB just wanna check something with you. If this account is from 2011 then section 127 wont apply, so regardless of compliance with section 77-79, i believe they can still issue court proceedings. Whether they know this is another matter, but thought id mention it incase your view is different.

s.127(3) won't apply as its post 04/07 HOWEVER that only means the judge cannot rule Irredeemably UE - but if there are other failures such as s.60, s.61, s.86(a), s.87, s.88 - to name a few; it CAN still be defended and discontinued.

So post 04/07 or not, send a s.78 request regardless

[The Tech Clerk]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

Trouble is they can get a charging order once a CCJ is in place, (Their insurance), that is another Tory missive couple of years ago.

Could request extension of temporary payments as you state, CONC :- Look at the highlighted guides:-

Financial Conduct Authority (FCA)

The Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) has published the Consumer Credit sourcebook (CONC) which looks at whether a debt is being collected fairly. Although the FCA cannot investigate individual complaints, you can still use their rules guidance when disputing a debt on the grounds of limitation. All of the rules and guidance applies, no matter how old the debt is. In the Consumer Credit sourcebook (CONC), the FCA includes the following rules and guidance:

• "...a firm must not attempt to recover a statute barred debt in England, Wales or Northern Ireland if the lender or owner has not been in contact with the customer during the limitation period." 7.15.4 Rule
• "It is misleading for a firm to suggest or state that a customer may be the subject of court action for the sum of the statute barred debt when the firm knows, or reasonably ought to know, that the relevant limitation period has expired." 7.15.7 Guidance
• "A firm must not continue to demand payment from a customer after the customer has stated that he will not be paying the debt because it is statute barred." 7.15.8 Rule

You can make a complaint to your local trading standards department, who can look into your case. You can also complain to the FCA, as they can look into companies’ behaviour, even though they cannot deal with individual complaints. See the Useful contacts section later in this fact sheet, or contact us for advice.
The Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS)

You may be able to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) about the way a company has dealt with your account. You must follow your lender’s complaints procedure first. You can only use FOS to complain about events that happened from April 2007 onwards. See the Useful contacts section later in this fact sheet, or contact us for advice.

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

I was in two minds to suggest whether you should tell them that if they go ahead with legal action resulting in a CCJ you could lose your job and then they'd not get any payments. I can't decide if that would only encourage them to go for a CO or not. What do you think?

I also note that in November they told you they were considering selling your account. If only they would then things could be easier for you.

I've re-read that letter and it does say that unless you've "nothing more you wish to add" you can consider that as their Final Response. So get a letter off to them as soon as you can and then you can refer to the FOS a few days later.

If you make an offer to pay then they must either accept or reject it.

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

You've sent a s.78 request to Nationwide with a copy to Shoosmiths. Has that been acknowledged by either/both?

Now you need to send a LBA response letter to Shoosmiths which you should edit to suit. For example you won't be requesting the Notice of Assignment since this debt is still with the original creditor (isn't it?). The template letter is here:

http://www.all-about-debt.co.uk/inde...ction-response

I've now read your most recent letter from Nationwide. Unless I've missed something it doesn't say it's their Final Response. You can refer a complaint to the FOS eight weeks after making it with or without a Final Response. Your complaint was made 17th February so it's too soon to refer to the FOS.

At the moment the only complaint I see brewing is possibly one of 'heavy-handedness' otherwise known as harassment. To be honest their tone is polite although the message is strong.

The letter is clear that they will be seeking a charging order on your property (after court proceedings) simply to secure the debt because the amount you have been paying will take 97 years to clear the balance outstanding. They say it's their policy to only take such draconian steps (my words not theirs) if a debt cannot be cleared within 66 months. They say they agreed £6 per month for six months only. Their letter invites you to respond if you're not happy with the contents.

We don't give debt advice but if I were in your position I would take them up on that offer to keep a line of communication open. You could write back and inform them that your financial problems are only temporary and you envisage new work prospects in the near future. You could suggest you continue to pay £6 for a further six months and would be happy to undergo a review of the situation in six months time. The tone of your letter should be a mixture of financial hardship and optimism for a future upturn.

What I find distasteful is their comment that they would never seek an Order for Sale or ever require you to make any payments once they have a Charging Order. I see that as being somewhat predatory and possibly the basis of a FOS complaint. They are tempting you (while you're in a financially vulnerable position) to acquiesce to a CO in return for stopping payments.

[XX007]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

OK will do.

Thanks Plan B

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

Do I inform Nationwide and Shoosmiths I have written to the ombudsman.

Only once you have

I'm not here this week (clearly ) but I'll take a look back through your thread to see the basis of your complaint to Nationwide tomorrow.

Can you email me a copy of your complaint letter to Nationwide and their Final Response to it please to planB@all-about-debt.co.uk

Shoosmiths often jump the gun with legal proceedings so this needs to be done asap.

Can you clarify if you've already referred your complaint to the FOS.

Plan B x

[XX007]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

I've had another look at the letter from Nationwide and it is a final response letter, and they have sent me an ombudsman leaflet.

Do I inform Nationwide and Shoosmiths I have written to the ombudsman.

Should I copy in Nationwide & Shoosmiths on my ombudsman letter bearing in mind the 31st March deadline

[XX007]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

I'm all for sending numerous letters asking questions however irrelevant as long as it doesn't look too frivolous.

You may want to consider whether the complaint you made to Nationwide is 'unfulfilled'. You could demand a Final Response from them with the threat that you'll refer it to the FOS. Once that's done in theory (albeit not always in practice) legal proceedings should not be issued while the matter is investigated by the FOS which can take up to a year.

Just my thoughts without proper evaluation of the whole backstory.

Plan B x

I've had another look at the letter from Nationwide and it is a final response letter, and they have sent me an ombudsman leaflet.

Do I inform Nationwide and Shoosmiths I have written to the ombudsman.

[SXGuy]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

In that case, i think your right about also sending a final response letter to nationwide, as this could nicely add to halting proceedings, a CCA Request should buy some time for this also.

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

If this account is from 2011 then section 127 wont apply, so regardless of compliance with section 77-79, i believe they can still issue court proceedings. Whether they know this is another matter

I completely agree with you.

The CCA request is simply an attempt to take the account out of the auto-generated letter database system thingy which presses the MCOL button, to hopefully start a conversation. The idea is to get them to focus and feel under pressure to agree something reasonable.

I fully expect Shoosmiths to say the same as you've said.

The OP is resigned to having to pay this debt eventually. He's got until 31st March to sort it.

We can't win 'em all sadly

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

I'm all for sending numerous letters asking questions however irrelevant as long as it doesn't look too frivolous.

You may want to consider whether the complaint you made to Nationwide is 'unfulfilled'. You could demand a Final Response from them with the threat that you'll refer it to the FOS. Once that's done in theory (albeit not always in practice) legal proceedings should not be issued while the matter is investigated by the FOS which can take up to a year.

Just my thoughts without proper evaluation of the whole backstory.

Plan B x

[SXGuy]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

PlanB just wanna check something with you. If this account is from 2011 then section 127 wont apply, so regardless of compliance with section 77-79, i believe they can still issue court proceedings. Whether they know this is another matter, but thought id mention it incase your view is different.

[XX007]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

Thanks for taking the time to look at this plan B. I did get the CCA out to nationwide today with a copy to Shoosmith's as well and I will send the letter you refer to next week.

I was intending to email to ask about what term they would want the loan repaid. It was suggested to me 60 months on my last phonecall to Nationwide in February.

Do you think there is any point responding to the reply from Nationwide about the complaint I made and querying why they ignored my letter and gave me the wrong balance or would I better saving my paper?

[PlanB]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

Thanks Plan B. I will email it over now

I've now seen that letter and it is undoubtedly a LBA in my view.

It tells you how much you owe and why (the full balance demanded due to the creditor terminating your agreement for breach of contract) , what they expect you to do about it (agree repayment proposals within 14 days), what will happen to you if you don't (they'll issue legal proceedings without further notice), and where you can go for legal advice (CAB etc etc). It seems to tick all the Pre-Action Protocol boxes.

Having said that the tone is they would be happy to come to a repayment arrangement in preference to court action. Probably because this would be a Smalls Claims Court case so they won't get their fees paid even if they win (unless you were unreasonable).

I suggest you send them the CCA request asap (hopefully you did that today).

Their letter is dated 17th March so the 14 day deadline expires 31st March. You have time to negotiate with them if that feels like the right thing for you to do. I'm mindful of your need not to get a CCJ due to your job.

This is a 2011 account so playing the UE card may be difficult unless they've messed up somewhere along the line. We need to check everything.

We have an excellent LBA Response letter which may be your next step. It refers to you having sent a CCA request which is outstanding so give it a few days before sending it. This letter may well delay the start of any legal proceedings.

Give us a nudge on Tuesday which will be a full week before that LBA deadline expires.

If you want to panic before then and make an offer to settle this debt then that's understandable and not unwise, just ask us what would be an appropriate amount etc. Whatever happens they should request an I & E from you to demonstrate to the FCA that they haven't bullied you into paying more than you can afford. That debate will also take time.

Plan B xx

[XX007]

Re: XX007 - UE Diary - Tomorrow never dies

Thanks Plan B. I will email it over now

Might this help?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]17076[/ATTACH]

Thanks. I will print a dozen out now.