Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

I've got your email and replied.

Glad to hear you've got a dog who may not appreciate the Receiver's company if he turns up unannounced

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

No problem, the clearer we can get it the better.

Original loan was £64,000

Business bank account with £5,000 overdraft - Loan given to me to cover the overdraft that I had difficulty paying because business wasn't bringing in any money at that point, this was when the charge on the house was taken, then that overdraft was restructured into the mortgage when the business closed and the business account shut. I'm afraid I don't know if it was regulated/unregulated. I only seem to have bits and pieces of paperwork.

No credit card with them. Other cards I've dealt with

They state I owe £44,600 now and that it is all arrears. (Lots of charges and interest on it until they froze it)

Property is worth approx £130,000 I guess. Valuation done about 5yrs ago was £100,000 but had central heating installed (Solid fuel)

Never a Ltd Company, was a sole trader.

The business premises is a small area attached to the 'front' of the house that was used as a shop. We now use it as a storage area. It hasn't any heating or plumbing and the wiring's pre 60's. We use the door to it to enter/leave the property although there is another door around the other side of the property. I wrote to the council and asked for change of use to domestic as they were still trying to charge business rates and domestic rates which I couldn't afford. I have their acceptance letter somewhere.

xx

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

Original loan was £64,000

Business bank account with £5,000 overdraft - Loan given to me to cover the overdraft that I had difficulty paying because business wasn't bringing in any money at that point, this was when the charge on the house was taken, then that overdraft was restructured into the mortgage when the business closed and the business account shut.

They state I owe £44,600 now and that it is all arrears. (Lots of charges and interest on it until they froze it)

Sorry to be daft but is this the situation?

Loan A in 1999 of £64k to buy the business which included your house. Was there a charge taken over either the business premises or the house or both at the time?

Loan B in 2009 of £5k to replace the business overdraft but the bank took a charge over your house at the same time (why if they already had a charge?)

Loan C in ???? of £x to consolidate the outstanding balance of Loan A & B?

What is the expiry date of the current loan being chased by the Receivers or has that already expired?

Did you have PPI on any of these loans?

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

No charge that I'm aware of on the original loan. That was just a commercial mortgage. (Unless that creates an automatic charge) for the whole property, shop and dwelling.

The charge was taken for the £5000 loan

There wasn't a 3rd loan, they just added loan B to loan A (sorry my terminology saying 'extended' may have confused the issue.)

The current loan is with recoveries department, they say it is all arrears. Original mortgage was for 25 years but I guess it's deemed expired.

No PPI but I had to take out Critical illness cover.

xx

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

No charge that I'm aware of on the original loan. That was just a commercial mortgage. (Unless that creates an automatic charge) for the whole property, shop and dwelling.

The charge was taken for the £5000 loan

There wasn't a 3rd loan, they just added loan B to loan A (sorry my terminology saying 'extended' may have confused the issue.)

The current loan is with recoveries department, they say it is all arrears. Original mortgage was for 25 years but I guess it's deemed expired.

I would be surprised if a £64k Commercial Mortgage wasn't secured on your property. The fact you think it wasn't secured makes me wonder whether everything was explained to you properly (including the consequences of defaulting on the loan terms) when the bank sold you the product in the first place

Did you deal with the bank manager or was this done through a broker?

If the mortgage was for 25 years from 1999 then it wouldn't have expired until 2024 so should have another nine years to run (you need to check my sums because I failed 'O' Level Maths in 1966 so I did that calculation on my fingers ).

Dig out as much paperwork as you can. You may need to send the bank a Subject Access Request to get all the historical documents.

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

I failed math too. I have Discalculia. (They just called it thick then).

Dealt with manager, he's not there any longer. I think I'll have to do that request as I can only find the 2nd loan docs but will have a deeper dig for original first. I don't usually destroy important papers so am surprised at how little I can find.

By my reckoning £450 a month with a lump from my compensation would pay it off in that time. Especially if I can up it a bit more sometime.

Xx

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

The business premises is a small area attached to the 'front' of the house that was used as a shop. We now use it as a storage area. It hasn't any heating or plumbing and the wiring's pre 60's. We use the door to it to enter/leave the property although there is another door around the other side of the property

More questions I'm afraid

Do you know the square footage of the "shop" and the square footage of the living accommodation? Or at least the ratio such as 80% house 20% shop.

Could you enter the house without going through the shop and vice versa i.e. is the house a separate dwelling even though you're using the shop for storage these days? You initially said that you bought a business with a house "attached". Do you have any photos or floor plans you could email me?

Did the shop and the house ever have separate ratable values? The shop may have had business rates while the house may have had domestic rates. Or were they always combined for rateable purposes?

What was the purchase price of the property when you bought it in 1999? Did that include any shop fittings etc? How did you spend the original loan of £64k? Was it solely to buy the business/house or was any of it used to renovate/refurbish either the shop or the house (or buy a car etc)?

We're looking at the status of the loans and whether they should have been regulated or unregulated which depends on what happened when they were restructured in 2009.

Plan B x

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

I can only find the 2nd loan docs but will have a deeper dig for original first. I don't usually destroy important papers so am surprised at how little I can find.

Email me the two loan documents.

Then you need to get the rest of the paperwork asap. Send a SAR to Barclays using this template letter and enclosing a £10 payment with it. It will be a wise investment

http://forums.all-about-debt.co.uk/s...l=1#post495040

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

Hi, Thank you. As soon as I get a working scanner I'll mail the docs to you.

The 'shop' part is even less than 20% not sure it's even 15% of the whole building, if that. I'll look out particulars. The rest of the ground floor is probably twice the size and upstairs is around 3 or 4 times bigger.

The asking price was £64,000, so everything went to that. No stock or cars bought out of the mortgage. That included the names and addresses of the newspaper rounds, an old till, a very old ice cream freezer and the shop counters and shelving. (They are made out of reclaimed wood, again pre-1960's). It was a no deposit mortgage if that's helpful.

There is another door to the rest of the building so we can enter/leave elsewhere. The 'shop' has a door of its own. There is a lockable wooden door between the shop area and the house area.

Yes there were separate council tax bills, which was why I did change of use to domestic. (Our council tax didn't raise after that). Business rates for the shop and domestic for the rest.

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

Your answers to my questions are really helpful. I'm not being nosey or intrusive and I also don't want to reveal yet why I'm asking them.

Can you email me the exact address of your property as I'm having difficulty tracing it on Land Registry etc. The history of the property is important and so it the Title Plan. Does it have a 'street name/number' or only the name of the property which has changed according to the LPA Receiver's letter?

The "shop" had a change of use (when you bought it?) so that may be the issue.

So let me know (by email and not on this thread) what it was called when you purchased it, please.

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

No problem more than happy to get everything clear, it has always been a problematic address. I once received a letter addressed 'The Manager, village name. I've emailed you. I'm off work Wednesday so can really dig for the docs and play with the scanner to see if I can get it working. x

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

it has always been a problematic address. I once received a letter addressed 'The Manager, village name. I've emailed you.

I've got your email and from the information given I've sourced a photo of the property in the mid-nineteenth century. You live in a beautiful spot

Do you intend to resurrect the business and could it be viable once again? Or could it be sold off separately from the house (on a lease if it's included in the Freehold) if you ever wanted to do that?

I'm just throwing out ideas in an attempt to help you to keep the LPA Receivers' grubby little hands off your home.

I've been told that in order to get you and your husband out of the property there would have to be possession proceedings since you are owner occupiers. I thought that would be the case. Where there are legal proceedings there is hope because it gives you a voice in court.

Plan B x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

You're right it really is lovely here, with a great community to boot, and the house probably hasn't changed much.

I have no intention of running the business myself again. Apart from any other considerations there's another shop in the village now and it couldn't sustain two. I've got a decent full time job now and don't want to risk that sort of thing again really.

I guess if it came to it we could lease the shop area if anyone wanted it and close off the access to the house, but whomever took it would need to do an awful lot of work to get it up to the spec needed for planning. Not something we can afford unfortunately. It's why we've not done it before, all the work required.

That's sort of good news they'd have to go down the possession route, as you say at least we'd get to put our case.

Should I send anything to the receivers as they've asked or wait until they contact us again?

Oh, and probably a stupid question; The SAR request, do I send it to the recoveries department that I've been dealing with using their reference? Also, would signing it first name, current married surname Nee maiden surname be sufficient. or would I need to do two?

x

[Disastra]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

Quick update: Received a letter from the receiver today addressed to 'The Occupier'. Advising they've been appointed and saying no further rent or profit should be paid to me. (If only there were someone paying me rent or profits lol). They've actually said do not pay to first name, maiden surname, his representatives or any other party. Inaccurate on two counts. I am Mrs and haven't used my maiden surname for 6 years.
Also asking in order to establish the nature of your occupation to provide them with a copy of the lease or other agreement under which you occupy the property and evidence of your last payment.
I'll add it to the pile of paperwork.

[PlanB]

Re: Sudden lpa receiver threat after 5 years of regular monthly payments

Received a letter from the receiver today addressed to 'The Occupier'. Advising they've been appointed

This means they have absolutely no idea who is living in the property so it's time for you to tell them

Immediately write back a holding letter informing them that the property is residential and has been your home since 1999. Enclose a copy of your current Council Tax bill to support this. (Are you on the electoral roll?)

Tell them that you have been paying £xx per month to Barclays and the next payment is due on xx October. Ask them if they would prefer you to make the payments direct to them in future and to provide you with their bank details.

Keep it short and finish by saying that you will write again within the next 14 days with further information.

Was the first letter the Receiver sent in your maiden or married name? I think you should write back using your current name (if that's on your Council Tax bill) and advise them of the name change. If you want to make things crystal clear then enclose a copy of your marriage certificate but don't let that delay your response.

I have more to say but sending this letter is a priority. Get proof of posting or preferably send it Recorded Delivery if you can.

Plan B x