Pookies UE Diary

[MrsD]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

absolutely right Clogs




did i just agree with you 100%?????

[CleverClogs (RIP)]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

did i just agree with you 100%?????

I'm sure you'll soon recover.

[IF]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

absolutely right Clogs




did i just agree with you 100%?????

I'm sure you'll soon recover.

[oldyboy]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Yes im worrying because defaults coming off and its all gone so quiet... makes me think 'they' are up to something!!

Hi Pooks,

I know the feeling too. It always has made me wonder when it's gone quiet. I now think what it really means is that 'they' are losing and, as CC has said, they've gone off to find easier targets, as all bullies do.

I know it's easier to say than actually do, but do your best to relax and enjoy the peace. Always remember should anything turn up through the letter box, you can always get help and support here.

[DNW]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

As it was not a regulated consumer credit agreement, they do not need to send such an agreement as that agreement does not exist. However, the creditor does need to prove that the money is owed and that, if the alleged debt has been assigned to them, that the alleged debt is owed to them.


No, they're not.

The law has been changed (link and overdrafts are no longer excluded. They now have to comply with section 61A (link - duty to supply copy of executed consumer credit agreement) and/or section 61B (link - duty to supply copy of overdraft agreement) and failure so to do may impair their chances of enforcing the alleged debt.


It's about time that was stopped.

Oh I didnt know that, has it recently been changed then? Is there a template letter I could send them as they refused to comply with the first request saying it was not covered by the consumer credit act and therefore they did not need to send it.

I'm also very interested to know if there's a template/letter to be sent - our overdraft account has just been passed to DCA a couple of days ago and I've sent nothing in response as yet.

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

I'm also very interested to know if there's a template/letter to be sent - our overdraft account has just been passed to DCA a couple of days ago and I've sent nothing in response as yet.

Yeah I really could do with sending something to Cabot with the telephone harassment letter, saves on two lots of recorded delivery haha.

On a more serious note, can anyone tell us please if there is a new template letter containing the correct legislation/reg number to quote. If I send them another CCA letter they are just going to return it saying they don't have to comply as I believe the letter refers to a different section of the law to the new bit that now includes bank account overdrafts. Also, will the new legislation cover my overdraft debt seeing as this debt goes back quite a number of years?

Thanks, Pooks

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Hi Pooks,

I know the feeling too. It always has made me wonder when it's gone quiet. I now think what it really means is that 'they' are losing and, as CC has said, they've gone off to find easier targets, as all bullies do.

I know it's easier to say than actually do, but do your best to relax and enjoy the peace. Always remember should anything turn up through the letter box, you can always get help and support here.

Your right of course, will try

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Enjoy the quiet - only worry you get something to worry about!

Yeah your right, will try to stop worrying. Wish the CRA's would update their files though and remove those defaults...I thought they came off automatically after 6 years. Ive asked them twice to remove them but they are still there ;(

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

You may want to look at this --->allaboutFORUMS - View Single Post - Flossy UE Diary YB Hassle - although it would need to be adapted to suit.

Thanks for this but I am confused.... I dont know how to copy bits of threads but on page 4 of this thread I put a post about my reply from a couple of creditors including Cabot in relation to my bank account overdraft... here is what I put and Niddy's response.. it was only a few weeks ago so im confused as to why your's is different to mine when they are both with Cabot and both in relation to overdrafts.

Cabot who have sent my postal order back and state there is no need for them to provide a copy of my credit agreement as it does not apply to current accounts. They go on to say i have a £1206 balance and a payment plan for arranged for monthly instalments of £5.47.. hmmm not any more! Should I now contact Cabot and arrange to continue paying this privately?

Thanks, Pooks

This was Niddy's response..

correct, you ought to be trying to make a F&F, say around £100 to close this.... if you have it of course?

My letter from Cabot said:

I understand you have made a request for information pertaining to your account pursuant to section 77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ("CCA").

There is no need for us to provide a copy of your credit agreement under the CCA for Current Accounts and Overdraft Facilities, as Part V of the CCA does not apply to these types of accounts. The exclusion of Current Accounts fallling into Part V of the CCA is set out in section 74(1)(b). I have therefore returned your £1.00 fee with this letter.

Im confused as it appears to be the same letter you got... wonder if Niddy thought I was meaning something else as he agreed they did not have to supply it??

Thanks, Pooks

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Hi all again... right im very very confused now after reading back through my posts regarding the Yorkshire Bank overdraft now with Cabot haha. Page 3 and 4 it seems the opinion is that the overdraft is not covered and they dont have to send a CCA. Page 6 a post from Clever Clogs states regulations now changed and they are not exempt and Flower Power's link on the above post, seem to also suggest they are not exempt. Does anyone know please? Shall I send a copy of the same letter that Flower sent?

Thanks, Pooks

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Hi,

It's not really me who's dealing with Cabot on that thread, it's from Flossy's diary. I posted the link because you were after bits of legislation regarding O/Ds and Niddy drafted that letter in response to Cabot's letter which says exactly the same as yours. It's not a CCA request as such but a request for information as set out here ---> Consumer Credit Act 1974

It's one of them 'Niddy specials'. He may have drafted it after your response from Cabot.

Ok, thanks ever so much. Yeah Flossy's!! Sorry, I'm just very confused over all the legislation. Looking at Clever Clogs' post overdrafts are no longer exempt, I looked at the link from Clever Clogs but didnt understand any of it let alone know how to put it in a letter. I just want to make sure I'm sending the right stuff and quoting the right stuff otherwise they are gonna know I know nothing haha! I will rehash the 'Niddy special' letter and send that then. Thanks again and sorry for being a pest.

Pooks

[CleverClogs (RIP)]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

My letter from Cabot said:

I understand you have made a request for information pertaining to your account pursuant to section 77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 ("CCA").

There is no need for us to provide a copy of your credit agreement under the CCA for Current Accounts and Overdraft Facilities, as Part V of the CCA does not apply to these types of accounts. The exclusion of Current Accounts fallling into Part V of the CCA is set out in section 74(1)(b).

As one might expect of Cabot, they have been somewhat economical with the actualité - link:

74 Exclusion of certain agreements from Part V.
(1)Except as provided in subsections (1A) to (2), this Part does not apply to—
(a)a non-commercial agreement,
(b)a debtor-creditor agreement enabling the debtor to overdraw on a current account, ... etc.

They seem either not to know, or not to care, that paragraph (1) now contains the words "Except as provided in subsections (1A) to (2)". Subsection (1C) applies to your overdraft:

(1C)Where an agreement that falls within subsection (1)(b) is an authorised non-business overdraft agreement the following provisions apply—

(a)section 55 (regulations on disclosure of information);
(b)section 55B (assessment of creditworthiness);
(c)section 55C (copy of draft consumer credit agreement);
(d)section 56 (antecedent negotiations);
(e)section 60 (regulations on form and content of agreements);
(f)section 61B (duty to supply copy of overdraft agreement).

It's probably anyone's guess quite why Cabot continues to claim that section 74(1)(b) excludes overdrafts as it did before the law was changed; I suspect it may be because they do not have a copy of the documents, cannot obtain a copy of the documents or even that some of the documents may no longer exist.

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

As one might expect of Cabot, they have been somewhat economical with the actualité - link:

They seem either not to know, or not to care, that paragraph (1) now contains the words "Except as provided in subsections (1A) to (2)". Subsection (1C) applies to your overdraft:

It's probably anyone's guess quite why Cabot continues to claim that section 74(1)(b) excludes overdrafts as it did before the law was changed; I suspect it may be because they do not have a copy of the documents, cannot obtain a copy of the documents or even that some of the documents may no longer exist.

Thank you so much Cleverclogs, I have copied the letter that Niddy did for Flossy and rehashed it a bit, I will now quote some of the above too ... just to reinforce the issue. Im gonna tag the telephone harassment letter onto the bottom.. again amended a bit. Hopefully that will stop them in their tracks as they are driving me insane with a dozen, if not more, calls every single day!! I will post it up in a mo and it would be great if you can let me know what you think. Thanks

[CleverClogs (RIP)]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Im gonna tag the telephone harassment letter onto the bottom.. again amended a bit. Hopefully that will stop them in their tracks as they are driving me insane with a dozen, if not more, calls every single day!!

That has to be stopped.

Are the calls on a landline or on a mobile?

Either way, a change of number should help, although BT could intercept 'nuisance calls.

Meanwhile, keep a whistle by the phone and, whenever the money-grubbers call, deafen the buggers!

[pooksthebear]

Re: Pookies UE Diary

Right here is my letter, I am not sure where to put those bits in (quoted above) so ive left them out.


Dear Sirs,

Ref: xxxxxxx

I acknowledge receipt of your letter and I would like to point out that regardless of the provisions of sections 77-79 you seem to have forgotten about The Consumer Credit (EU Directive) Regulations 2010 and also c.39 (s.74 (A&B) (VA)) CCA(1974).

As I had what can only be classed as an agreed overdraft, then the lending becomes regulated in line with Part VA (s.74) (s.1(b)) meaning the normal rules and CCA(1974) protection applies.

The lender also needs to send an annual reminder to me regards the overdraft, as well as copies of the original agreement made and an annual renewal form that contains the relevant prescribed terms that are clearly outlined in s.74(A)2(a,b,c,d,e). As nothing of the sort has ever been recorded as received by myself, this account is in fact unenforceable.

You go on to mention that "The exclusion of Current Accounts falling into Part V of the CCA is set out in section 74(1)(b)" . I have read this and I would like to know what makes you exempt? Before quoting legislation, please try and understand the principle behind it first. Your claim regards s.74(1)(b) is not in context based on the fact the provision within s.74(A)(2) has failed; I highlight this provision for your perusal;

s.74A(2) The current account agreement must include the following information at the time it is made:
(a)the rate of interest charged on the amount by which an account-holder overdraws on the current account or exceeds the pre-arranged overdraft limit,
(b)any conditions applicable to that rate,
(c)any reference rate on which that rate is based,
(d)information on any changes to the rate of interest (including the periods that the rate applies and any conditions or procedure applicable to changing that rate), and
(e)any other charges payable by the debtor under the agreement (and the conditions under which those charges may be varied).

Please also pay attention to s.74(B)(2) which reads, I quote;
s.74B(2) The matters referred to in subsection (1) are:
(a)the fact that the current account is overdrawn or the overdraft limit has been exceeded,
(b)the amount of that overdraft or excess,
(c)the rate of interest charged on it, and
(d)any other charges payable by the debtor in relation to it (including any penalties and any interest on those charges).

I trust that I have set out my position clearly? I await your response with the requested information, as per my original letter (assuming you have the information, of course).

On another matter, that of telephone harassment The quantity and frequency of the telephone calls I have received from your company is beyond a joke.

I now require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only. I am of the view that your continued harassment of me by telephone puts you in breach of Section 40 of the Administration of Justice Act 1970, and the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

I ought to draw your attention to the recent Harrison v Link Financial case in which HH Judge Chambers outlined the predatory way in which the account holder was hounded;

I quote, from this judgment;

Cumulatively and damningly is what I find to be the way that MBNA and the Defendant went about recovering their debt. I am satisfied that the Claimant’s description of the way that he was hounded by his creditors is essentially correct not least in the use of “non-traceable” telephone calls. It seems to me that such conduct has no proper function in the recovery of consumer debt.

If you continue to harass me by telephone, you will also be in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127 and I will report you to OFCOM, Trading Standards and The Office of Fair Trading, meaning that you may be liable to a substantial fine and/or other sanctions as they see fit. Be advised that any further telephone calls from your company may be recorded and used in evidence and I expect this harassment to cease immediately.

Yours faithfully,