Spud's UE Diary

[Spud]

Lloyds Tsb Credit Card

Start: Nov 1997
Balance: £12000
Last Full Payment: Nov 2011
Present: Not making payments
Status: Defaulted, Firmly on the Debt collectors merrygo-round

2012

Jan 20th
Change in circumstances letter sent – token Payments
Jan 31st
Arrears letter received
Feb 22nd
Please freeze interest and token payment sent
Feb 29th
Arrears letter received
March 19th
Confirmation of circumstances letter received
March 21st
CCA request letter sent
March 23rd – Received 27th
Default Notice issued – Not enough time to rectify
March 28th
CCA reply received – Total recon with wrong address for period ect
April 2nd
Missing prescribed terms letter sent
April 5th
Please freeze interest and token payment sent
April 23rd
MHA Collections – Cannot accept your token payments ect
April 25th
SCM Solicitors – Pay within 14 days or Court proceedings Threat ‘O’ Gram
May 17th
Contact only in writing and token payment sent
May 18th
Formal Complaint – Harassment by Telephone
May 29th
SCM Solicitors – Pay arrears or court Threat ‘o’ Gram
May 30th
Formal complaint Acknowledgement letter
June 19th
MHA Collections – Reduced payment offer - £309 P.C.M – Yeah right!
June 19th
Please freeze interest and token payment sent
June 27th
MHA Collections Income/Expenditure request – Cannot accept token payments
July 5th
Copy of application form received with some terms
July 18th
Please freeze interest letter and token payment sent
July 27th
BLS Collections – Introduction & threat of home visit letter
August 17th
BLS – Contact us – possibility of repaying on reduced payments
August 20th
Please freeze interest/Contact by phone and token payment sent
August 28th
BLS – Essential that I phone BLS today….. I did’nt !!!!
Sept 11th
BLS – A “personal visit may be required” letter
Sept 20th
Contact only by letter and token payment sent
Sept 26th
BLS – Contact us within 14 days or force us to commence legal action…
Oct 22nd
SCM Solicitors – Pay balance within 7 days to avoid court proceedings
Oct 22nd
Contact by letter only and token payment sent
Nov 17th
Please freeze interest and token payment sent
Nov 23rd
SCM Solicitors – Cannot accept token payments letter
Dec 18th
Token payment sent


2013

Jan 8th
SCM Solicitors – Tried to contact me without success – Would I give them a call? Letter
Jan 21st
Token payment sent
Feb 6th
CCA Emailed to Niddy - Niddy says
Feb 21st
SCM – Unable to accept token payments letter
April 25th
Your account has been allocated to Wescot – Very poor quality letter - Suspicious
May 3rd
Wescot Hello letter
May 12th
Wescot – Final Notice letter
May 13th
Letter to Lloyds checking April 25th letter was genuine
May 22nd
Wescot - Reduced settlememt offer - Call us to see
June 8th
This debt will not go away letter
June 19th
Threat of doorstep recovery letter
June 25th
Modified "prove it letter sent" to Wescot
June 25th
Formal complaint to Lloyds - Harassment by telephone
June 29th
Wescot - We acknowledge that you have raised a dispute letter
July 9th
Wescot - Our client ( Lloyds Tsb) have advised that given the age of the account a copy agreement is not available letter, PS still pay us!!!!
July 23rd
Reply from Lloyds TSB regarding complaint - We will remove Telephone numbers
Sept 9th
Lloyds Tsb letter - Account assigned to Moorcroft for collection
Sept 11th
Moorcroft introduction letter
Sept 23rd
Moorcroft possible further action letter
Sept 30th
Prove it / Telephone harassment/ No CCA letter sent to Moorcroft
October 4th
Moorcroft letter - We have been instructed to collect - Know of no reason for non payment letter
October 7th
Telephone harassment letter sent to Moorcroft
October 13th
Moorcroft letter - Contacting Lloyds Tsb regarding your quiry - No CCA received
November 9th
Letter from Lloyds Bank - Thankyou for your complaint - Please give us a call ( No account number on letter ect)
November 14th
Letter to Lloyds Bank - No telephone calls and which account does this refer to ect
November 15th
Please contact us so we can discuss your complaint ( Crossed in post)
November 26th
Received another CCA from a Card upgrade and half a rainforest of old statements from Lloyds - This is missing prescribed terms and terms and conditions do not match ect - Niddy confirmed still 100%
December 9th
Letter to Lloyds Bank - Asking for clarification for what exactly has been sent to me on Nov 26th - As there were so many papers

2014

January 23rd
Letter from Lloyds Bank - Confirming that they will only contact me in writing
March 11th
Letter from Moorcroft - Important information - Possible further action ( Gave me 2-3 days to reply before action)
March 14th
Letter to Moorcroft - Official complaint - Sending unfair requests/threats with no time for compliance
March 25th
Latter from Moorcroft - Thank you for your complaint - The account is now closed on our systems
March 29th
Letter from Lloyds bank - We are transferring the account to Robinson way
April 4th
Letter from Robinson Way - Welcome letter
April 5th
Letter from Moorcroft - Reply to my complaint
May 2nd
Letter from Robinson Way - Account remains unpaid letter
May 12th
Letter to Robinson Way - Prove it letter
May 12th
Letter to Moorcroft - Further letter of complaint ( Ongoing complaint they still have not addressed)
May 23rd
Letter from Robinson Way - Thank you for your complaint - We will stop collection activity
July 7th
Letter from Robinson Way - The account remains unpaid letter and you have not been in contact
July 7th
Statement letter from Lloyds Bank
August 27th
Letter to Robinson Way - Official Complaint - Unfair collection activities

2015

June 4th
Statement letter from Lloyds Bank
July 20th
Letter from Cabot - We have recently bought your account
July 22nd
Letter from Lloyds Bank - We have sold your account to Cabot
September 10th
Letter from Cabot - Introduction letter
September 21st
Letter from Cabot - We have been unable to gain your committment to pay
October 5th
Letter from Cabot - As you have not contacted us - Your account may be reviewed for legal action
October 7th
Letter to cabot - Account in dispute and telephone harassment letter
October 8th
Letter from Cabot - Payment offer letter from Cabot

2018

May 8th
Letter from Cabot - We have received your CCA request ( I have not made a CCA request ??)
May 16th
Letter from Cabot - An update on my request - We have not heard back from the original lender
December 8th
Letter from Cabot - Sent some terms and conditions


Diary entry for this account up to date

I have lost the colours for the sent/Received letters - I will update the colours when I am able to make it easier to read

[Spud]

The important thing is not to say/do anything now which could damage your case if they do decide to issue a claim in future. Don't help them to remedy any flaws in advance.

Thank you Di

Believe me........I have no intention of doing that

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

You are correct Di, Last payment I have recorded was Jan 2013

Original CCA request turned up an application form that was not completely clear - thats it - So was deemed UE by Niddy

Recent (Same) application form copy received but with some variation terms?????

Sent a copy to Niddy - Who advised to send Missing PT's letter - Which was promptly sent

A couple of letters since - Just addressing my complaint ( Missing PT's) and the account will now be passed back into the collections progress ( And potentially reviewed for legal action)

From what you say you're seven months away from this debt being Statute Barred based on last payment being January 2013. Cabot may know that too which may be why your file has been singled out for attention.

The important thing is not to say/do anything now which could damage your case if they do decide to issue a claim in future. Don't help them to remedy any flaws in advance.

If Cabot decide to go for it they will instruct solicitors, typically Mortimer Clarke, Restons or Shoosmiths. The solicitors will contact you direct and should send a Letter Before Claim giving you 30 days to react before issuing a claim. That will be the time to throw them a curved ball if necessary.

I've replied to your email

Di

[Spud]

Ok

So massive apologies for not updating this ( or indeed being here much recently)........I need to change that and hopefully I should be able to now

In short - You are correct Di, Last payment I have recorded was Jan 2013

Original CCA request turned up an application form that was not completely clear - thats it - So was deemed UE by Niddy

Recent (Same) application form copy received but with some variation terms?????

Sent a copy to Niddy - Who advised to send Missing PT's letter - Which was promptly sent

A couple of letters since - Just addressing my complaint ( Missing PT's) and the account will now be passed back into the collections progress ( And potentially reviewed for legal action)

Diary entry for the Tesco account has been updated a couple of posts back ( post no 387) - Colour's to follow !!!!

[Spud]

Thank you Di and Tech Clerk, I have not got on here much over the last few weeks ( Months)

I will update over the next few days

Oh and a fantastic tip with ref. to SAR requests.......Wait I shall - Thanks Techie

[The Tech Clerk]

Send SAR request on/after 25th May as no charge from then

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I can see that Cabot sent you an Application Form and Ts & Cs in February this year.

Have you emailed those documents to Niddy to get his opinion on their enforcebility?

I can also see that Tesco sent you a credit agreement in February 2013 which Niddy said was unenforceable Has Cabot sent you the same document?

I'll read back through the whole history to see if there are any other potential flaws with the account.

This might be a good time to send a Subject Access Request to Tesco to get the full history of the account. This should include the 'Transaction Log' where you'll see exactly what went on. If its not in the Log then it didn't happen (as they say).

Was your last payment 21st January 2013 making this debt potentially Statute Barred in eight months time?

Di

[Spud]

Tesco Credit Card

Start: July 2000
Balance: £3000
Last Full Payment: Nov 2011
Present: Not making payments
Status: Defaulted. Terminated, DCA Merry go Round - Sold to cabot

2012

Jan 19th
Default sum notice received
Jan 20th
Change of Circumstances letter sent
Feb 1st
Arrears letter received
Feb 10th
Financial statement request - Sent reply
Feb 18th
Letter received detailing last two payments
Feb 22nd
Contact in letter only and token payment
March 1st
Default notice received
March 22nd
Letter aknowledging my token payments
March 21st
CCA Request letter sent
April 5th
Token payment letter sent
April 16th
CCA reminder letter sent
April 16th
Request for signature for CCA
April 19th
Letter received detailing my last two payments
April 20th
Letter asking for signature ref CCA request – Declined
April 20th
Reply to signature request and reminder letter
April 20th
Termination letter received
April 26th
Letter asking for my signature ref CCA request
May 2nd
Formal complaint - Not replying to my letters - Kept my £1 CCA fee ect
May 17th
Account in dispute letter sent
May 29th
CCA Reply Received - Application form & terms (missing date!)
May 30th
Account in despute letter sent - Cannot read terms sent ect
June 9th
Letter received - Cannot yet respond to formal complaint
June 15th
Another ( Same) copy of application form received
June 19th
Letter – Please freeze interest and token payment
July 18th
Letter – Please freeze interest on the account and token payment
July 19th
Monthly budget form received wanting I & E details
July 19th
Default sums letter plus last 2 payments letter
August 20th
Contact by letter and please stop interest letter plus token payment
Sept 3rd
Letter received – No interest is being added to account…..Finally
Sept 3rd
Monthly budget form received
Sept 20th
Letter – Contact by letter only plus token payment
Oct 8th
We accept your token payment offer
Oct 22nd
Contact only be letter and token payment sent
Nov 17th
Token payment sent
Dec 18th
Token payment sent


2013

Jan 21st
Token payment sent
Feb 6th
CCA emailed to Niddy –Niddy says UE
March 4th
We have not received your payment “you agreed to make” letter
March 19th
Reply to above.....There is not an agreement in place
May 27th
Letter - Account passed to recoveries team
June 18th
We are concidering passing to an external Collections agency
June 20th
I am still awaiting a reply to a letter of complaint dated 19th March - No reply
June 25th
We are concidering legal action to recover your debt
July 2nd
Modified "Prove it" letter sent - Not satisfied CCA request
July 4th
Sorry to hear of your complaint - We will investigate
July 11th
We are not in a position to respond yet letter
July 15th
We will shortly be taking further action against you to recover the debt
July 24th
Tesco Bank - We are still investigating your complaint
July 30th
Tesco Bank - You must take action - Call us today
Aug 15th
Tesco Bank - Account passed to Moorcroft for collection
Aug 21st
Moorcroft - Introduction letter
Aug 22nd
Tesco Bank - We will only contact you in writing - Reply to complaint
Aug 30th
Moorcroft - Possible further Action - Contact us
Sept 2nd
Letter sent to Moorcroft - No CCA received and Telephone harassment
Sept 8th
Thankyou for your recent letter - If you want proof of account - Send £1
Sept 13th
Moorcroft - Monthly installment offer letter received
Sept 27th
Midas Credit Services - Possible further Action letter
Sept 30th
Letter to Midas - Telephone harassment letter sent
Oct 5th
Moorcroft - Explaining our position - No reason for non payment ect
Dec 19th
Moorcroft - Offering me a monthly installment offer

2014

Jan 3rd
Letter from Midas Credit Services - Possible further Action
Jan 17th
Letter from Moorcroft - We are passing this tyo our home collections division.....Division Love it!!!
Feb 9th
Letter from Moorcroft - Discount offer letter
Feb 10th
Letter to Moorcroft - Harassment/No contact other than in writing letter sent
Feb 21st
Letter from Moorcroft - We can confirm that this account is now closed on our system
Feb 21st
Letter from Tesco Bank - We are passing this account onto Robinson Way
Feb 27th
Letter from Robinson Way - We are going to negotiate repayment of your debt letter
Mar 8^th
General – We would like to help you letter from Robinson Way

Mar 28^th
Letter sent to Robinson way – I have no knowledge of a debt with Robinson Way

April 10^th
Letter from Robinson way – We are requesting a copy of your agreement for you

June 4^th
Letter from Robinson way – We are still waiting to hear from our client ref your disputed debt

June 7^th
Letter from Robinson way enclosing a bad photocopy of a credit card application form

July 25^th

Letter from Robinson way – We want to work with you to find a solution

August 16^th
Letter from Tesco Bank – We are passing the account onto Wescot

August 21^st
Introduction letter from Wescot

August 31^st
We can confirm that you are resident at that address letter from Wescot

Sept 10^th
Discount offer from Wescot

Oct 1^st
We want to work with you letter from Wescot

Oct 11^th
Letter from “2F” Confirming that I live at my house !!!

Oct 27^th
Letter to Wescot – I am not aware of any debt being owed to Wescot/Prove it letter

Nov 11^th
Letter from Wescot – Thank you for your contact – We will investigate

Nov 14^th
Letter from Wescot – We enclose a copy of your application ( Which was not enclosed)

Dec 28^th
Letter from Wescot – We are awaiting further information from our client


2016

Nov 9^th
Letter from Tesco Bank – We are assigning this account to Cabot Financial (UK) ltd

Dec 17^th
Introduction letter from Cabot

Dec 31^st
We really want to help you letter from Cabot

2017

Feb 6^th
Letter from Cabot – We would really like to hear from you ( No threats)

Feb 25^th
Letter from Cabot – We have being trying to contact you – our aim is to help you ( No threats)

March 31^st
Letter from Cabot – We want to work with you to clear this debt ( No threats)

May 4^th
Letter from Cabot – We have not heard from you letter ( No threats)

July 24^th
Letter from Cabot – We need your attention


“At the moment we dont have any payments been received or a commitment to a repayment plan

As a reasonable next action to recover the outstanding balance your account has been reviewed for legal action

You need to contact us within 28 days so that we can prevent this from happening”

August 9th
SWID letter sent to Cabot

August 21st
Letter from Cabot - We will investigate your complaint

October 9th
Letter from Cabot - We are investigating your complaint and will contact Tesco

2018

February 2018
Letter from Cabot - Tesco have informed us there is no dispute - Sent copy of Application form and a set of terms and conditions

March 2018
Letter from Cabot - We are waiting to hear from you - Could look to take legal action template letter

April 2018
Letter from Cabot - Your outstanding balance - Potential legal action
A basic template letter outlining "what legal action could mean" and advising that their standard approach would be to instruct a solicitor to issue a claim etc etc stating that if they do not hear from me within 14 days they will proceed as highlighted above

April 2018
Letter from cabot - We have received a response from Tesco who state that there is no ongoing dispute with myself

April 2018
Missing PT's letter sent to cabot

May 2018
Letter from Cabot - We have not heard from you - We are reviewing your account for legal action

June 2018
Letter to Cabot - Brief letter explaining they are incorrect and I sent a letter in April of which I have proof of receipt

June 2018
Letter from Cabot - There is no dispute with this account - The account may be reviewed for legal action



I will attempt to put the sent/Received colours back into operation to ease identification

[Spud]

I will update the diary soon but I did send the Sold in dispute letter and they wrote back stating they will investigate my complaint......All standard stuff

Not heard a thing for about a month now.....

It will be interesting to see what they come back with

[SaltnVinegar]

Hi Spud - It's been a while since your last update. How's things going? Any news?

Best
SnV

[Spud]

Thanks all and to Di......Expert knowledge as ever

It was so long ago now that I cannot quite remember the exact details ( I need to check ) but I seem to remember that the breaches could be redeemed should they put their mind to it etc. You know some of the stuff they get past DJ's

I think I did SAR Tesco some time ago but will need to check my filing cabinet and come back ( Away for a few days at the moment)

Its a difficult one.....hence the post....BUT I am slightly swayed towards making communication and at least making them aware that there are problems ( without spelling it out of course)

decisions decisions

[JLC]

Cabot's position is "Buyer Beware"
In other words they should know or have been informed when they purchased. All a SWID is really doing is reminding them of outstanding unresolved issues!

My understanding is that even if UE they can still ASK and isn't this ALL they are doing here!
Their actions are those commensurate with a buyer who KNOWS the debt is disputed and UE and is actually pestering you!

Diana has pipped me here and with good advice.

For my cabot debts, there are no CCAs. One is an old virgin card, one is hsbc credit card which was issued with my bank account and the third they state is another HSBC credit card which they will never get a CCA for as it's not with HSBC (this is on hold and has been since December). I'd like to think I'm reasonably safe as I'm certain they will never get the information they need. All three accounts were deemed unenforceable from what was sent from Moorgate/Idem, which is why they were sold on in the first place. All three are also pre 04/07.

[Roger]

Cabot's position is "Buyer Beware"
In other words they should know or have been informed when they purchased. All a SWID is really doing is reminding them of outstanding unresolved issues!

My understanding is that even if UE they can still ASK and isn't this ALL they are doing here!
Their actions are those commensurate with a buyer who KNOWS the debt is disputed and UE and is actually pestering you!

Diana has pipped me here and with good advice.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I've taken a peek at the history of this debt and my first question is why was the credit agreement deemed unenforceable in 2012 (what was the flaw) and was/is it something that could be remedied if they subsequently produce a reconstituted version?

Or was it irredeemably unenforceable (so fatally flawed never to be remedied)?

There's reference in your post to you receiving an application form with Ts & Cs which had no date. But if they accurately sourced the date could they come up with a convincing (to a DJ) recon?

One way to find the answer is to send a Subject Access Request to Tesco so you get the full history of the account which should include the Transaction Log providing details/dates of what happened and when (or not at all). It'll come in handy if they do issue a claim so the £10 statutory fee won't be wasted.

I also see that the account was assigned to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd which is unlicensed by the FCA (it lapsed in February 2015 which was prior to your debt being assigned to them by Tesco in November 2016) which may cause them a problem if they decide to litigate.

If this went to court and your legal representative asked the court to order costs against them due to conduct issues (even though it would be in the Small Claims Track) Cabot could argue that they brought the proceedings in good faith since you had never told them there was a problem/dispute.

I've skilfully not answered your question (whether to write to Cabot) but I hope I've given you food for thought

Di

[MisterK]

As I understand things, if it is UE then it would never get to court as it would easily be knocked out before then by AAD's superb legal team if a claim were to arrive. So not communicating with them couldn't result in a "defence" that you were simply avoiding the debt as they'd never get an opportunity to use this point against you.

(It wouldn't be a "defence" for them anyway as they would be the claimant, but I know what you mean, JLC).

If it isn't UE and you were blagging it then you'd likely get the opportunity to avoid court by negotiating with them later on.

Just my tuppence worth, but am no expert and probably know less than you Spud, I've just picked up what I've been able to glean here, so I'd also be interested to know if there's a different angle to it.

Personally I go for the "silence is golden" strategy. Keeps things simple, less possibility of compromising your position and so hopefully a more straightforward task for the legal team. I do take your point though that a shot across the bows with a SWID might well be a good thing to do at the right point in time.