PRA Diary

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Details:

Type of account: Barclaycard

Date commenced: 2002

Approximate balance: £2,542.74

Date last payment was made - approximate date last full payment was made: Feb 2014

Are you on an arrangement or not paying; Payment through StepChange

Status (default/arrangement/up to date): Default in August 2014

Account owner: PRA

I sent the CCA recently and Barclays through PRA have written back with a reconstituted copy of terms and conditions and credit agreement form 2012. they are stating that they completed their obligations but I'm not sure that they have?

Have PRA left you alone or are they still chasing you for this old Barclaycard debt from 2002?

They have issued a number of claims for ex-Barclaycard debts over the Christmas/New Year period so keep a close eye on things.

Di

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Hi

it was always with Barclaycard.

Is there any update on this PRA debt?

Di

[DCC2000]

Hi

it was always with Barclaycard.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I was just wondering if my CCA documents had been received?

Sorry to ask, just keen to get back to PRA.

Niddy is away until Monday when I'm sure he'll take a look at your credit agreement.

May I ask if this was a Barclaycard from the beginning or could the account have opened with Egg, Monument, Morgan Stanley Dean Witter, Goldfish etc before being acquired by Barclaycard?

Obviously an unenforceable credit agreement is a good thing, but the assignment can be an even bigger issue for a debt purchaser since the Claimant has to prove that they own the debt before they can get a CCJ.

This is my personal experience with PRA as explained by Jo >

‘“RECONSTITUTED AGREEMENT” – IRREDEEMABLY UNENFORCEABLE”
“UNREDACTED DEEDS OF ASSIGNMENT – NO ASSIGMENT PROVED”


So, held Recorder Bellamy in PRA Group (UK) Limited v Mayhew at Central London County Court on 22nd March 2017, at the end of a 3 day multi track trial, when dismissing PRA’s claim against our client.


Stale debts sued for on the back of 2 ‘reconstituted’ MBNA credit card agreements (May 1999 and October 2000) were held irredeemably unenforceable under CCA 1974. The evidence of an honest witness was preferred to that of so called “reconstituted agreements”.


After 3 days of close forensic examination of, and legal argument about, evidence and documents from both PRA and MBNA stating that our client’s specific debt had been assigned, the court held that no assignment had been proved.


Efforts, over many months, in earlier cases to force PRA into disclosure of un-redacted deeds and deep and sustained forensic challenge to the provenance of documents needed to prove regulatory compliance, finally drew back the veil. The reality behind bulk debt purchasing was revealed.


This decision shows that just saying an agreement is enforceable and producing a “reconstituted” copy does not prove that it is enforceable. Just saying an agreement has been assigned and producing a notice saying it has been assigned does not prove legal assignment.


Debt purchasers need to provide proof. If that means the pitifully few pence in the pound they pay for stale debts will increase because banks will now have to start keeping original evidence complying with regulatory consumer protection measures, it is hard to imagine many tears being shed, outside the City of London.

Di

[Roger]

I am not quite sure if that figure is correct- I have heard amounts paid depend on a lot of things but are often 10-15% of the face value
That is probably worth bearing in mind if you do decide to go down the full and final settlement route .
If PRA start ramping up the heat, it may be worth sending a request under GDPR (what used to be called a SAR) to Barclaycard to get details of what was sent and when but probably a little premature at the moment

Logic tells me that DCA's sift and priortise DEBTS Sic Post Code, Google etc. etc, employment and status. They will know through experience and Case studies where to target their own resources. So not all Debts are of equal value!
We just see off course Our own Debts. But what we ideally want is Ours to be at the bottom of that priority pack! Another very good reason for letting sleeping DCA's lie!

[Warwick65]

A reality check PRA paid 1p in the pound to Barclaycard for your debt.

.

I am not quite sure if that figure is correct- I have heard amounts paid depend on a lot of things but are often 10-15% of the face value

That is probably worth bearing in mind if you do decide to go down the full and final settlement route .

If PRA start ramping up the heat, it may be worth sending a request under GDPR (what used to be called a SAR) to Barclaycard to get details of what was sent and when but probably a little premature at the moment

[Roger]

It was sent to PRA with a 1£1 postal order. The response was from PRA but just enclosed Barclays response to me. I don't have a copy of the DN (I wasn't in a good place when these started to come in 2014).

Well 2019 AAD is a GOOD PLACE to be NOW!

A reality check PRA paid 1p in the pound to Barclaycard for your debt.
Barclaycard get tax relief on your Bad Debt
PRA are NOT a Charity.

Get Niddy to check out this paperwork.

[DCC2000]

It was sent to PRA with a 1£1 postal order. The response was from PRA but just enclosed Barclays response to me. I don't have a copy of the DN (I wasn't in a good place when these started to come in 2014).

[Warwick65]

You certainly need to wait and see what Niddy says but from what you say there does seem to be a problem with the documents they sent you.

Just out of interest- who did you send the CCA Request to , was it Barclays or PRA. It should have been PRA and it should have been PRA who responded

If it helps, what you should have received in response to a CCA with the £1 fee is

A copy or a reconstituted agreement that was valid at the time you opened the account
The terms and conditions from the time you took out the card

A second set of terms and conditions from when the card was defaulted

All of the above should be clearly legible



Apart from that, you say the account was defaulted in 2014. Do you have the DN ? This may be rather useful if it is not good

[DCC2000]

My plan is to go self managed and look at some F & F Offers, just want to review the enforceability before I make any move.

[Roger]

https://all-about-debt.co.uk/forum/d...ry#post1525810

In your Diary entry dated 24th June I notice that you are paying through stepchange .

I presume that you are still making these payments? If this is the Case you don't have any reason to contact PRA do you?

A CCA's 77/78 request (plus £1) - I presume you sent the £1 - covers you in Law until such times as they fulfil that request.
BUT S 77/78 is for information purposes NOT necessarily PROOF (Nightwatch points out that they would need a copy of the original).

There are many reasons, not just CCA S 78 why a Debt may be Unenforcible!

If you are still paying them, through Stepchange then I can't see that you have any reason to contact them!
I think that what you need is for Niddy to check out the various Documents that PRA have sent you to see whether they have fulfilled your S 78 request!

[DCC2000]

Hi,

The T&C's are from 2012 too and no reasoning for the recon,

[nightwatch]

Hi, you say the account was opened in 2002, but they have sent you an agreement dated 2012, is there any date on the T&C's they have sent,
the CCA should be the one you signed in 2002 and should also have the T&C from that date .

Yes they have fulfilled your request by sending a recon but it is supposed to be of the original,plus they are supposed to say why it is a recon.
any court action will require a copy of the original, this is their problem not yours

Barclaycard are a law unto themselves, I havebeen sent 4 different lots of T&C's for mine none of them dated 1999 when they were taken out.

wait and see what Niddy says, never be in a rush to reply to A Dca

[DCC2000]

Thanks

[cymruambyth]

Hi, Niddy (Never in Doubt) who checks the agreements works, so will check them when he can. Don’t reply too promptly to any DCA!