SarahSarah Diary: UE and negotiating settlements

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Any thoughts from anyone on this? In summary, Halifax/BOS never sent me any information following my SAR in 2018. Cabot have never sent me a CCA, nor even a recon and in fact wrote in 2017 that they were still looking but that the debt is currently unenforceable. MC say they sent me copies but I have not received that.

Did Mortimer Clarke’s letter say exactly when they sent you copies?

And if I have understood you correctly Halifax/BOS have not complied with your SAR from 2018 so maybe send them another. Why didn’t they comply with your original SAR - was there a reason (they asked for identification) or was it just silence?

Di

[Never-In-Doubt]

Any thoughts from anyone on this? In summary, Halifax/BOS never sent me any information following my SAR in 2018. Cabot have never sent me a CCA, nor even a recon and in fact wrote in 2017 that they were still looking but that the debt is currently unenforceable. MC say they sent me copies but I have not received that.

Can anyone elaborate on what their quoting of the Carey v HSBC case means? I assume that it's not applicable here as my agreement was with Halifax, not Cabot?

Hiya

If they're in default of your s.78 request then do not chase them - they are just that - in default (so cannot enforce). Presumably you aren't paying them anything (if so I'd stop - like yesterday!)....

The case you mention had the one and only Joanna Connolly involved - she's our solicitor here. Joanna Connolly

So she's able to help with any direct queries on that case lol

[SarahSarah]

• Halifax
• Credit card
• Approx 2002
• £1,100
• Last full payment approx Oct 2007. Last DMP payment Jun 18.
• Arrangement via a DMC 2007-2018
• Defaulted. Now dropped off credit file.
• Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd

Mar 08: Default notice from Halifax.
Apr 08: Account passed to Blair, Olivier & Scott Ltd Debt Collectors
Sept 12: Halifax write to advise that "Halifax has assigned all of it's respective rights, title and interest... to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd. " Later in the letter is states "Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited has been appointed by Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd to manage your account in line with the arrangements agreed with Blair, Oliver & Scott".
Sept 12: Welcome to Cabot letter "The Cabot Credit Management Group has recently bought the account you held with Halifax..."
Aug 13: Cabot offer a partial settlement of around 30%. Said it would be full and final settlement but marked as partially settled. Refused.
Jul 14: Settlement offer from Cabot of around 70%, refused.
Jun 17: My settlement offer of around 30% refused.
Jun 17: Sent CCA request.
Jul 17: We don not have this info (CCA) on file, however we have asked for it.
Sept 17: Letter from Cabot saying they have not been able to provide me with the requested info, credit agreement currently unenforceable.
une 18: Cancelled DMP. Payments no longer being made to this account.
July 18: Sent SAR to BOS (nee Halifax).
July 18: First letter from Cabot after cancelling DMP. Suggesting Step Change. Saying account now on hold for 14 days.
early Aug 18: received a response to SAR asking to sign my original letter. I have signed with a signature different to the one I used in 2002.
September 18: Received a statement of account showing 3 months with zero paid.
May 19: Letter from Cabot saying they have failed to make contact so will instruct "a company called Moorcroft to try to arrange a visit at your home to that they can put you back in touch with us". They go on to say they would rather speak to me within the next 7 days "or you'll receive a visit from Moorcroft".
Jul 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they may pay me a visit if I don't call to arrange payment. The standard letter.
Jul 19: Letter from Halifax BOS saying they have been unable to find any info, please send DOB, previous address and signature. Which I did.
Aug 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they will pay me a visit on a specific date. I have sent the harassment / doorstop template letter.
Sept 19: Response from Moorcroft saying they have passed my letter on to their client as liability lies with them. they will not make contact regarding collection of the balance whilst the issue is being investigated.
Nov 19: Letter from Cabot saying "we have been trying to contact you, please fill in this financial summary".
Feb 20: Letter - We are going to appoint Resolvecall to visit you. Call us or expect a visit from them.
Mar 20: Letter - Avoid legal action, you have 21 days. You account will be placed with a solicitor who will send you a letter before action.
Mar 20: Letters - You have 14 days before we commence legal proceedings... Then you now have 7 days...
Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.
Jun 20: Letter Before Claim received from Mortimer Clarke Solicitors. Ticked box D and returned.
Aug 20:Letter from MC - We notice you have not completed income/ expend form, please reply within 10 days. Filed.
Sept 20: Another Letter Before Claim received. Ticked Box D and returned.
Oct 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke - "We really need to talk to you... we are instructed to issue court proceedings and we recently wrote to you about this but we'd prefer to talk to you." Filed.

Nov 20: Letter from MC - "We note you have indicated you dispute the debt, however you have not clarified why". They then refer to a letter they say they sent in July which I didn't receive. They enclose a copy of the letter which states that is encloses: copy of reconstituted agreement, historic terms, statement of account from original creditor and statement of account from our firm. It also states that "our client is not able to provide a copy of the original credit agreement as well as the following:

"Please be advised that under the FCA Consumer Credit sourcebook at rule 13.1.4, a firm able to reconstitue a copy of the agreement, and there is no obligation to provide a copy which includes a copy of the signature. This was also confirmed in the case of Carey v HSBC Bank PLC (2009) EWHC 3417"

It then details background of the debt, my dispute, their investigation then says that Cabot complied with my requests for a CCA but includes them again (I didn't receive this letter they refer to with these copies). Furthermore the enclosed statement of account shows the numerous payments you have already made towards the debt which we would say is eveidence that you are aware of the debt. (I was paying via a DMP until Jun 18). In conclusion, they say I am liable for the debt and they will hold the debt for a further 21 days, please complete income/expenditure.

Anecdotally, I am now unemployed due to redundancy.

Any thoughts from anyone on this? In summary, Halifax/BOS never sent me any information following my SAR in 2018. Cabot have never sent me a CCA, nor even a recon and in fact wrote in 2017 that they were still looking but that the debt is currently unenforceable. MC say they sent me copies but I have not received that.

Can anyone elaborate on what their quoting of the Carey v HSBC case means? I assume that it's not applicable here as my agreement was with Halifax, not Cabot?

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Thank you, I’ve emailed you.

Everything now under control

Di

[SarahSarah]

Neither until I've seen the Letter of Claim

Di

Thank you, I’ve emailed you.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Do you suggest I stick to Box D due to "non-compliance with S77-79 CCA Request" or do you think I should remind them of that Sept 17 letter stating that can't supply the CCA and confirmed it unenforceable?

Neither until I've seen the Letter of Claim

Di

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

• Halifax
• Credit card
• Approx 2002
• £1,100
• Last full payment approx Oct 2007. Last DMP payment Jun 18.
• Arrangement via a DMC 2007-2018
• Defaulted. Now dropped off credit file.
• Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd

Mar 08: Default notice from Halifax.
Apr 08: Account passed to Blair, Olivier & Scott Ltd Debt Collectors
Sept 12: Halifax write to advise that "Halifax has assigned all of it's respective rights, title and interest... to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd. " Later in the letter is states "Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited has been appointed by Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd to manage your account in line with the arrangements agreed with Blair, Oliver & Scott".
Sept 12: Welcome to Cabot letter "The Cabot Credit Management Group has recently bought the account you held with Halifax..."
Aug 13: Cabot offer a partial settlement of around 30%. Said it would be full and final settlement but marked as partially settled. Refused.
Jul 14: Settlement offer from Cabot of around 70%, refused.
Jun 17: My settlement offer of around 30% refused.
Jun 17: Sent CCA request.
Jul 17: We don not have this info (CCA) on file, however we have asked for it.
Sept 17: Letter from Cabot saying they have not been able to provide me with the requested info, credit agreement currently unenforceable.
une 18: Cancelled DMP. Payments no longer being made to this account.
July 18: Sent SAR to BOS (nee Halifax).
July 18: First letter from Cabot after cancelling DMP. Suggesting Step Change. Saying account now on hold for 14 days.
early Aug 18: received a response to SAR asking to sign my original letter. I have signed with a signature different to the one I used in 2002.
September 18: Received a statement of account showing 3 months with zero paid.
May 19: Letter from Cabot saying they have failed to make contact so will instruct "a company called Moorcroft to try to arrange a visit at your home to that they can put you back in touch with us". They go on to say they would rather speak to me within the next 7 days "or you'll receive a visit from Moorcroft".
Jul 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they may pay me a visit if I don't call to arrange payment. The standard letter.
Jul 19: Letter from Halifax BOS saying they have been unable to find any info, please send DOB, previous address and signature. Which I did.
Aug 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they will pay me a visit on a specific date. I have sent the harassment / doorstop template letter.
Sept 19: Response from Moorcroft saying they have passed my letter on to their client as liability lies with them. they will not make contact regarding collection of the balance whilst the issue is being investigated.
Nov 19: Letter from Cabot saying "we have been trying to contact you, please fill in this financial summary".
Feb 20: Letter - We are going to appoint Resolvecall to visit you. Call us or expect a visit from them.
Mar 20: Letter - Avoid legal action, you have 21 days. You account will be placed with a solicitor who will send you a letter before action.
Mar 20: Letters - You have 14 days before we commence legal proceedings... Then you now have 7 days...
Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.
Jun 20: Letter Before Claim received from Mortimer Clarke Solicitors.

Would you like to email that Letter of Claim to me?

This debt is unenforceable since Cabot have not complied with your s77-79 CCA Request from June 2017. In fact you have a letter from them stating exactly that (i.e. unenforceable).

That legal position hasn't changed has it?

Di

[SarahSarah]

• Halifax
• Credit card
• Approx 2002
• £1,100
• Last full payment approx Oct 2007. Last DMP payment Jun 18.
• Arrangement via a DMC 2007-2018
• Defaulted. Now dropped off credit file.
• Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd

Mar 08: Default notice from Halifax.
Apr 08: Account passed to Blair, Olivier & Scott Ltd Debt Collectors
Sept 12: Halifax write to advise that "Halifax has assigned all of it's respective rights, title and interest... to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd. " Later in the letter is states "Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited has been appointed by Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd to manage your account in line with the arrangements agreed with Blair, Oliver & Scott".
Sept 12: Welcome to Cabot letter "The Cabot Credit Management Group has recently bought the account you held with Halifax..."
Aug 13: Cabot offer a partial settlement of around 30%. Said it would be full and final settlement but marked as partially settled. Refused.
Jul 14: Settlement offer from Cabot of around 70%, refused.
Jun 17: My settlement offer of around 30% refused.
Jun 17: Sent CCA request.
Jul 17: We don not have this info (CCA) on file, however we have asked for it.
Sept 17: Letter from Cabot saying they have not been able to provide me with the requested info, credit agreement currently unenforceable.
une 18: Cancelled DMP. Payments no longer being made to this account.
July 18: Sent SAR to BOS (nee Halifax).
July 18: First letter from Cabot after cancelling DMP. Suggesting Step Change. Saying account now on hold for 14 days.
early Aug 18: received a response to SAR asking to sign my original letter. I have signed with a signature different to the one I used in 2002.
September 18: Received a statement of account showing 3 months with zero paid.
May 19: Letter from Cabot saying they have failed to make contact so will instruct "a company called Moorcroft to try to arrange a visit at your home to that they can put you back in touch with us". They go on to say they would rather speak to me within the next 7 days "or you'll receive a visit from Moorcroft".
Jul 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they may pay me a visit if I don't call to arrange payment. The standard letter.
Jul 19: Letter from Halifax BOS saying they have been unable to find any info, please send DOB, previous address and signature. Which I did.
Aug 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they will pay me a visit on a specific date. I have sent the harassment / doorstop template letter.
Sept 19: Response from Moorcroft saying they have passed my letter on to their client as liability lies with them. they will not make contact regarding collection of the balance whilst the issue is being investigated.
Nov 19: Letter from Cabot saying "we have been trying to contact you, please fill in this financial summary".
Feb 20: Letter - We are going to appoint Resolvecall to visit you. Call us or expect a visit from them.
Mar 20: Letter - Avoid legal action, you have 21 days. You account will be placed with a solicitor who will send you a letter before action.
Mar 20: Letters - You have 14 days before we commence legal proceedings... Then you now have 7 days...
Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.
Jun 20: Letter Before Claim received from Mortimer Clarke Solicitors.

[SarahSarah]

I'll be here if you need me

Have Cabot forgotten the letter they sent you in September 2017 admitting that they didn't/don't have the credit agreement and therefore deemed the debt unenforceable!

Anything after that feels like bullying to me and a breach of the FCA Handbook CONC 13.1.6 > https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/CONC/13/1.html





Di

Hi Di, I've received the letter before claim from Mortimer Clarke on behalf of Cabot. Do you suggest I stick to Box D due to "non-compliance with S77-79 CCA Request" or do you think I should remind them of that Sept 17 letter stating that can't supply the CCA and confirmed it unenforceable?

Many thanks, as always.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

It does actually state in bold at the top "Re: Our client: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd

It's not a Letter Before Claim so I agree, I'll wait and see what happens...

Diana Mayhew may well hear from me again yet!

I'll be here if you need me

Have Cabot forgotten the letter they sent you in September 2017 admitting that they didn't/don't have the credit agreement and therefore deemed the debt unenforceable!

Anything after that feels like bullying to me and a breach of the FCA Handbook CONC 13.1.6 > https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/CONC/13/1.html

• Halifax
• Credit card
• Approx 2002
• £1,100
• Last full payment approx Oct 2007. Last DMP payment Jun 18.
• Arrangement via a DMC 2007-2018
• Defaulted. Now dropped off credit file.
• Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd

Mar 08: Default notice from Halifax.

Jun 17: Sent CCA request.
Jul 17: We don not have this info (CCA) on file, however we have asked for it.
Sept 17: Letter from Cabot saying they have not been able to provide me with the requested info, credit agreement currently unenforceable.

Di

[SarahSarah]

1/ Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd are not authorised with FCA
2/ Does the Mortimer Clarke letter mention anywhere Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd?
3/ Mortimer Clarke says pursue a claim IN THE FUTURE
4/ Pursue isn't issue and they would have to send a Letter Before Claim with 30 days delay before issuing a Claim BUT whether Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd can issue claims is another matter

You might consider a call to @Di (initial enquire is free) but if this was me I would File and see what they send next.

It does actually state in bold at the top "Re: Our client: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd

It's not a Letter Before Claim so I agree, I'll wait and see what happens...

Diana Mayhew may well hear from me again yet!

[Roger]

Sept 12: Halifax write to advise that "Halifax has assigned all of it's respective rights, title and interest... to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd. " Later in the letter is states "Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited has been appointed by Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd to manage your account in line with the arrangements agreed with Blair, Oliver & Scott".
Mar 20: Letters - You have 14 days before we commence legal proceedings... Then you now have 7 days...
Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.

1/ Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd are not authorised with FCA
2/ Does the Mortimer Clarke letter mention anywhere Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd?
3/ Mortimer Clarke says pursue a claim IN THE FUTURE
4/ Pursue isn't issue and they would have to send a Letter Before Claim with 30 days delay before issuing a Claim BUT whether Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd can issue claims is another matter

You might consider a call to @Di (initial enquire is free) but if this was me I would File and see what they send next.

[nightwatch]

Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.

---

Ok, does it say anything else, what may happen if you don't contact them, is it a LBA, with the obligatry questionare, I&E,?

[SarahSarah]

• Halifax
• Credit card
• Approx 2002
• £1,100
• Last full payment approx Oct 2007. Last DMP payment Jun 18.
• Arrangement via a DMC 2007-2018
• Defaulted. Now dropped off credit file.
• Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd

Mar 08: Default notice from Halifax.
Apr 08: Account passed to Blair, Olivier & Scott Ltd Debt Collectors
Sept 12: Halifax write to advise that "Halifax has assigned all of it's respective rights, title and interest... to Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd. " Later in the letter is states "Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited has been appointed by Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd to manage your account in line with the arrangements agreed with Blair, Oliver & Scott".
Sept 12: Welcome to Cabot letter "The Cabot Credit Management Group has recently bought the account you held with Halifax..."
Aug 13: Cabot offer a partial settlement of around 30%. Said it would be full and final settlement but marked as partially settled. Refused.
Jul 14: Settlement offer from Cabot of around 70%, refused.
Jun 17: My settlement offer of around 30% refused.
Jun 17: Sent CCA request.
Jul 17: We don not have this info (CCA) on file, however we have asked for it.
Sept 17: Letter from Cabot saying they have not been able to provide me with the requested info, credit agreement currently unenforceable.
une 18: Cancelled DMP. Payments no longer being made to this account.
July 18: Sent SAR to BOS (nee Halifax).
July 18: First letter from Cabot after cancelling DMP. Suggesting Step Change. Saying account now on hold for 14 days.
early Aug 18: received a response to SAR asking to sign my original letter. I have signed with a signature different to the one I used in 2002.
September 18: Received a statement of account showing 3 months with zero paid.
May 19: Letter from Cabot saying they have failed to make contact so will instruct "a company called Moorcroft to try to arrange a visit at your home to that they can put you back in touch with us". They go on to say they would rather speak to me within the next 7 days "or you'll receive a visit from Moorcroft".
Jul 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they may pay me a visit if I don't call to arrange payment. The standard letter.
Jul 19: Letter from Halifax BOS saying they have been unable to find any info, please send DOB, previous address and signature. Which I did.
Aug 19: Letter from Moorcroft saying they will pay me a visit on a specific date. I have sent the harassment / doorstop template letter.
Sept 19: Response from Moorcroft saying they have passed my letter on to their client as liability lies with them. they will not make contact regarding collection of the balance whilst the issue is being investigated.
Nov 19: Letter from Cabot saying "we have been trying to contact you, please fill in this financial summary".
Feb 20: Letter - We are going to appoint Resolvecall to visit you. Call us or expect a visit from them.
Mar 20: Letter - Avoid legal action, you have 21 days. You account will be placed with a solicitor who will send you a letter before action.
Mar 20: Letters - You have 14 days before we commence legal proceedings... Then you now have 7 days...
Apr 20: Letter from Mortimer Clarke saying "Cabot reserves its right to pursue a court claim in the future". Please contact us within 30 days.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I just don't want it to get to actual claim stage as the solicitor fees would be almost as much as the balance.

If Cabot decide to issue legal proceedings they would typically instruct Mortimer Clarke Solicitors who would add their fees and court costs to the balance claimed (I assume that is what you are referring to).

Di