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**The Tech Clerk** · 18 February 2018, 10:37

wescot are only collectors for some owners and have no powers, CCA request should go to the owners of the alledged debt, hopefully wescott (Wetcloths as known to some of us) have as indicated passed on with the fee.

keep copies of Cabots refusal letters - may be of some use later, even if not keep copy handy.

have you sent CCA1974 request to other alledged debts? could you start a diary here of each individual debt i.e. list :- credit card xxxxx taken out xxx defaulted ,,,, amount,, who owns now, what is recorded on Credit files etc people can then get a correct idea and suggest next action id any:- list credit cards/loans etc etc catalogue if any etc seperatly in a diary

**The Tech Clerk** · 18 February 2018, 10:39

ttps://www.all-about-debt.co.uk/for...s-esc-ue-diary

gives you a lay out to follow:-

**Bluemonday3** · 18 February 2018, 10:45

Thank you, I will look at doing this now. Thanks again.

**Roger** · 18 February 2018, 12:28

Originally posted by Bluemonday3 View Post

Hi I am new to this forum and feel a little angst to see if I am posting this in the right place?!
I have been in a DMP since 2009 with Stepchange..I have cleared almost £30k of debt and was well on the way to completing my DMP with £2700 approx worth of debt left to pay.

On 10th Dec I have sent off for CCA to Wescot who hold 3 of my debts, Cabot and Clarity.
Cabot have refused F & F offer I made of £60 on a debt of £201 and are asking why I can't just get another job?!!!
Cabot are the only ones to get back to me with a document of over 207 pages which includes statements!
I stopped my DMP payment in December 2017.
Cabot are now hassling me to pay as well as Wescot (even though Wescot have sent me letters saying the account is on hold until CCA is provided!)
..but the phone call from Cabot has left me feeling sick.
..Any advice would be great, thanks in advance.

Well first of all well done with clearing so much Debt!! Down to £2700 approx. from £30k!

Lets now deal with the sub humans leeches that are pestering you!
There is a template letter AAD+ Harassment by Telephone to send to Cabot
1/ The CCA requests Did you include £1 with these Requests ?
2/ Cabot's CCA's exclude the statements and send copies of each Agreement (unredacted!!) to Niddy referencing your entry here webmaster@all-about-debt.co.uk
He will be able to tell you whether these are UE or not.

Welcome to AAD

**Warwick65** · 18 February 2018, 20:54

Hi and indeed welcome

just remember as well, there is an awful lot more to unenforceability than just the agreement although it os much easier of the agreement is unenforceable as they don't have an argument.

personally, and no disres[ect to anyone, I know how tempting it is, I would try not to fall into the trap of calling these firms anything other than their actual name. It just makes the whole process so much more professional

As it is only recently you have stopped paying I would expect a lot of phone calls texts and letters but if you have call blocking on at least one phone do it- to be honest you soon get to know the area codes of these companies,

Clarity are in Northampton, I think on the A508 , in any event a nice little pub just by their offices although I thought they were owned by someone else now.

**Roger** · 18 February 2018, 22:34

Well these Debts normally start with a Consumer Credit Agreement so if makes sense to address that as the first priority. However UE can be complicated with Acts and Case Law etc.. and tactics are also important. Some UE can be corrected by the way this is why the AAD approach is to submit CCA unredacted Agreements as received to Niddy webmaster@all-about-debt.co.uk

AAD starts with the CCA request

Yes Bluemonday3 can block Calls etc.. But in this Case with that outrageous suggestion that he changes jobs for their benefit!!!
By sending the harassment letter this itself sets out the legal implications.

Bluemonday3 has pointed out that the extent of his yearly payments
".. a decrease in wage of approx £4500 each year. Oddly enough most of this equates to what I was paying through my DMP! .."
Its simply maths £4,500 * 6 = £27k leaving a small residual amount outstanding.

He has stated that he has sent out CCA's we simply need to know that this included the £1 with each because this £1 ensures he is covered by the Consumer Credit Act under S.78 .
He has some documents sent back from Cabot and excluding the statements (which will be the bulk) it will help Him if Niddy looks at the Agreements he has been sent.

This is a good starting point I would have thought for Bluemonday3 and the AAD Mods.

**cymruambyth** · 18 February 2018, 23:31

I agree with Warwick that by stopping payments there will be a lot of correspondence and threats, these are unfortunately the tools of the trade for DCAs. You will have to deal with this, just don’t speak to anyone on the phone - you can refuse the security checks.
As for UE, it is not only the agreement that counts as there can be many other errors that are not broadcast on sites so that they aren’t rectified.

Congratulations on clearing so much debt, now that your financial situation has got worse stop paying use the money to live; post on here and we will give you help and support to deal with everything.

**Warwick65** · 19 February 2018, 08:45

Originally posted by Roger View Post

Well these Debts normally start with a Consumer Credit Agreement so if makes sense to address that as the first priority. However UE can be complicated with Acts and Case Law etc.. and tactics are also important. Some UE can be corrected by the way this is why the AAD approach is to submit CCA unredacted Agreements as received to Niddy webmaster@all-about-debt.co.uk

AAD starts with the CCA request

Yes Bluemonday3 can block Calls etc.. But in this Case with that outrageous suggestion that he changes jobs for their benefit!!!
By sending the harassment letter this itself sets out the legal implications.

Bluemonday3 has pointed out that the extent of his yearly payments
".. a decrease in wage of approx £4500 each year. Oddly enough most of this equates to what I was paying through my DMP! .."
Its simply maths £4,500 * 6 = £27k leaving a small residual amount outstanding.

He has stated that he has sent out CCA's we simply need to know that this included the £1 with each because this £1 ensures he is covered by the Consumer Credit Act under S.78 .
He has some documents sent back from Cabot and excluding the statements (which will be the bulk) it will help Him if Niddy looks at the Agreements he has been sent.

This is a good starting point I would have thought for Bluemonday3 and the AAD Mods.

Roger
I will not get into an argument with you but I do need to point out the reasons for my post.

You may think I am some newcomer that knows nothing and why should I be listened to when you have been here 4 years- Surely all perspectives and comments should be accepted. There really is no one size fits all.

By the way I wasn't aware it was a case of you and us as in the mods and everyone else

Firstly , yes , of course the first step is the CCA request but I was trying to reassure Bluemonday3 that even if the agreement appears enforceable that does not mean it is because there may be other reasons. This was the case with the recent claim against me. It may have appeared that the CCA request was enforceable but in court we did not even get that far as there were more important issues ( and more easily winnable ones).

When I did all my CCA requests , it was gutting to be told many were enforceable but that was 6 years ago now and they are statute barred, but the decision not to pay was mine and mine alone.

Finally, with all due to respect to anyone, the only person who can ultimately say if an agreement is unenforceable is a Judge because, lets face it, we have seen some perverse decisions over the years

**Bluemonday3** · 19 February 2018, 09:41

Thank you for your responses. To be honest I am absolutely gutted to be so close to repaying this debt as I have always been committed to repaying and I have learnt some harsh lessons over the years, that said I was given advice elsewhere to check that the debts were enforceable as this may assist me to get F & F's accepted, which was my plan with this change in circumstances. I have managed to save a small amount which is what I intended to use to pay the creditors.
With the exception of Lloyds who I had a an overdraft and credit card with my debts were defaulted pretty much within the first few months so have now dropped off my credit file, so I have been advised that other than further action, they cannot damage my credit file any further( which is slowly picking up, not that I am looking to obtain credit)

I have had my eyes opened with regards to DCA's who have bought my debt for less than they are chasing me for so I feel a little less inclined to pay the full amount! I feel a bit cheeky saying that as it has gone against my idea to clear the debt in full, if they had stayed with the original creditor I would be inclined to carry on chipping away at the full amount.

Like I said I am very naive and have given into the demands of my creditors before, I have a mortgage and was concerned about them obtaining CCJ's etc.
Ideally I would like to settle the debts that it within the amount I have managed to set aside, but am prepared to pay token payments to keep them at bay.
I wish I had joined this sooner, as Cabot phoned me to set a repayment arrangement at a £1 per month plus I have to submit an I & E and it was during this phone call I was told the offer I made was not accepted, they completely ignored my letter!
So I am already making mistakes, so your advice here is invaluable.
Apologies this post is allover the place!

**Roger** · 19 February 2018, 10:03

Hi warwick65
I respect your sincerity I think its better one step at a time
The Tech Clerk; two entries #2 and #3 give Bluemonday3 the AAD starting point

Bluemonday3 already has some Agreements sent from CABOT which can be sent to Niddy webmaster@all-about-debt.co.uk
But if the request for CCA didn't include the statutary £1 these in Law wouldn't have the benefit of CCA S.78

Enforceable or Not? Niddy's track record (backed by any legal advice he may or may not take) is very very good and he errs on the side of caution.
I respect the help and knowledge on this site which has helped me personally beyond measure.

My advice would be one step at a time and read other diaries (read between the lines) because its a steep learning curve.
Now lets focus on Bluemonday3 if Cabot are pestering him he can send the harassment letter and if it continues I am sure the regulator would take a negative view of a DCA treatment of an honest Debtor!

**Bluemonday3** · 19 February 2018, 10:11

I can confirm that I did send £1 postal orders via registered post to each creditor, Clarity are the only ones who send me a £1 cheque back but did agree to look for the CCA.

**Warwick65** · 19 February 2018, 10:13

How you choose to deal with your debts is not really for us to question. All I or anyone can do is tell you what the options are. I was in a DMP for several years before circumstances changed and I considered bankruptcy - I am glad now that I didn't go down that route. I do 'get' how debt can feel overwhelming

As you say, once the defaults are off the credit file then , unless they gain a cci they will not reappear and I am also told a cci does not automatically appear on your file - but that's another discussion.

If the worst happens and a claim is issued that you find is undefendable there are often options that will set up arrangements and do not lead to a cci - so try not to worry too much about it.

Some of the tricks creditors have tried with me would make your toes curl- from trying to make me feel guilty , to downright lies.

Certainly , if you do CCA requests and then want to offer full and finals, having them not comply would strengthen your hand although personally I would argue why pay if they can't produce. However, in many cases they could remedy the problem later but if it helps, not one of my accounts has remind any failures in a CCA request at a later date.

You mention obtaining further credit, well I personally believe the claim issued against me was influenced by my applying for and getting a credit card - they may have thought that if I had sufficient income to get a card, I had sufficient income to pay them back. As it was, I wanted the card for convenience and not the actual 'credit'

**Roger** · 19 February 2018, 10:17

Bluemonday3 your entry #10
I to started with the intention to pay what I owed only to be treated like dirt!! Template DCA letters and harassing phone calls/ txt's/ emails/ etc..
Doesn't take much calculation to see that these have dropped off your Credit File and therefor the likely timeframe which these were incurred. This is what I mean by reading between the lines.
The F&F if this is your intended route you will be better off letting the DCA's come to you rather than your approaching them. You do this by starting off with that S.78 CCA request , stop paying and putting the money away.
Set out your Diary entries and take the benefit of Niddy's considerable experience.
AAD welcomed me without judgement and has helped me take control over my Debts. That same welcome is extended to you.
Let the DCA's come over with the £0 F&F offers!!

**Bluemonday3** · 19 February 2018, 10:37

Thank you again so much for responding to me. I am feeling nervous about not paying as I feel like I did when I first started my DMP and I was petrified.
I need to let Stepchange know that I am not intending to continue with the DMP as I know from recent communication with them they are wanting to supervise the F & F's but not via the route I was trying to do! I do understand there reasons for this!
I am trying to collate my information to post a diary but don't have all this to hand.
I will look to standing my ground with non payments, but I continue to feel worried about this, so your advice is invaluable, thank you

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