CCA check

[Roger]

Just because the CCA is enforceable doesn’t necessarily mean the account is enforceable as there are more than one aspect they have to comply with for total enforceability.
Also it is not always the case that the DCA will be able to obtain the CCA from the OC, there are contracts written which in some instances mean the paperwork may not be passed forward to Debt purchaser. Remember once sold the OC wants to spend as little time if any on the account, and just because by law they have to hold the records for you doesn’t mean they’ll pass it on to a third party.

Absolutely!! Don't overthink this! Tesco KNOW in part the Loan was applied to the Credit Card because a chunk of money at that time was paid OFF!
If the Credit Card is UE then this impacts immediately on the Loan!

Don't forget Intrum have potential issues over FCA Authorisation. There are questions over the UE of the Credit Card and the Loan is intertwined with the Credit Card Debt! Don't over think this! Make Notes as you have been doing!
Do something about your gambling!! which is behind your Debt problems.

This is far from cut and dry for Intrum and why has the Loan Debt been placed on the back burner!
Don't over think!

[Timewilltell]

Just because the CCA is enforceable doesn’t necessarily mean the account is enforceable as there are more than one aspect they have to comply with for total enforceability.
Also it is not always the case that the DCA will be able to obtain the CCA from the OC, there are contracts written which in some instances mean the paperwork may not be passed forward to Debt purchaser. Remember once sold the OC wants to spend as little time if any on the account, and just because by law they have to hold the records for you doesn’t mean they’ll pass it on to a third party.

[Timewilltell]

Are they writing to you as separate accounts? If so then I’d expect each to be serviced independently.

[dmdm85]

So a lot of the letters have been relating to the card account and not the loan account. If I were to receive a letter before claim would they have to do this as 2 separate letters for each account they have or could they just refer to one and then apply for a CCJ on both accounts? Just trying to get an idea on what I need to look out for.

[dmdm85]

Tesco Bank Credit card purchased by Intrum UK finance limited Jan 2022
opened online 2004
Last full payment date September 2018
No payments made for the last 11 months
Remaining balance £10,000
CCA request previously sent to tesco bank thought to be unenforceable SAR sent to Tesco Bank 15th April
Letters indicating they will take court action. Latest letters offering a discount to settle without court action. Letter received 06/05/22 dated 28th April to say they are getting ready for legal action.
Another letter received dated 09/05/2022 from the legal department stating they are in charge of getting a CCJ against me. The letter says if I do not get in touch by 19/05/2022 their solicitors will apply for a CCJ.
SAR received from Tesco bank Fri 27th May.
CCA received in SAR sent to Niddy who has again confirmed it looks to be unenforceable.

Update to confirm CCA looks to be unenforceable Letter received from intrums solicitors dated 26th September to state they are taking legal action against me.

[dmdm85]

Tesco Bank Personal loan brought by Intrum UK finance limited in Jan 2022
Opened online June 2017 original amount £24,500
Last full payment date September 2018
Regular £43 monthly payments from Feb 2021
Remaining balance £21,000 (sorry balance was wrong in the original diary).
No CCA request sent on this SAR sent to Tesco Bank 15th April
Letters indicating they will take court action. Latest letters offering a discount to settle without court action.
SAR received from Tesco bank Fri 27th May CCA received in SAR sent to Niddy who has confirmed looks enforceable.

Updated to confirm CCA is enforceable

[dmdm85]

Yes, not judging, just trying to get clear the ACTUAL situation. It helps us and the OP.

No problem I didn't take it as people being judgemental, I actually appreciate people taking the time to ask the questions about details I may have missed so thank you.

[Still Waving]

I don't think you are alone on AAD. Nobody judges here! The Diary approach really does help take control of Debt.

Yes, not judging, just trying to get clear the ACTUAL situation. It helps us and the OP.

[Roger]

So looking back I didn't quite clear the balances in full on the cards just the loan and then I stupidly carried on using them after. I still feel quite ashamed to admit that a lot of this was due to excessive gambling at that particular time and also replacing windows and boiler etc at home.

I don't think you are alone on AAD. Nobody judges here! The Diary approach really does help take control of Debt.
Its also good to read other diaries as long as you understand that tactics and indeed the Law (especially Case Law) changes over time.

Consolidation Loans present problems to the DCA's. Lets put it like that!
You are doing well!

[dmdm85]

Something not quite right here. If the 3 credit cards are still outstanding, you didn't use the loan to pay them off. Is it a case that you SAID those accounts would be cleared, but that you didn't do it?

So looking back I didn't quite clear the balances in full on the cards just the loan and then I stupidly carried on using them after. I still feel quite ashamed to admit that a lot of this was due to excessive gambling at that particular time and also replacing windows and boiler etc at home.

[Still Waving]

Not sure if this is important information or not but when I was going through the SAR paperwork I also went through bank statements from when the loan was received to see what existing debt was paid off with it, I have this listed below.

Existing Santander personal loan £13,600 (settled)
Tesco bank Credit Card £5000 (the other account now with intrum)
Barclaycard credit card £2000 (currently with PRA)
MBNA credit card £600 (still with MBNA)

So in total over £21,000 of this was used to pay existing debt. I know it sounds bad but I kind of forgot where it all went as I was so lost in it all at the time.

Something not quite right here. If the 3 credit cards are still outstanding, you didn't use the loan to pay them off. Is it a case that you SAID those accounts would be cleared, but that you didn't do it?

[Roger]

Not sure if this is important information or not but when I was going through the SAR paperwork I also went through bank statements from when the loan was received to see what existing debt was paid off with it, I have this listed below.

Existing Santander personal loan £13,600 (settled)
Tesco bank Credit Card £5000 (the other account now with intrum)
Barclaycard credit card £2000 (currently with PRA)
MBNA credit card £600 (still with MBNA)

So in total over £21,000 of this was used to pay existing debt. I know it sounds bad but I kind of forgot where it all went as I was so lost in it all at the time.

It may also be worth noting that when I first started getting in to difficulty I made an irresponsible lending claim which eventually the ombudsman went in favour of Tesco bank. All the correspondence for this was in the SAR. The reason for this being that I was surprised to get a personal loan if that size when I already had an existing loan with a £13,600 balance through Santander. I guess if I put that the reason for the loan was to pay existing debt then Tesco bank would have not taken the other loan in to consideration when lending. Apologies I appreciate this is a lot more information to take in but going through the SAR has jogged my memory in other areas that may be of importance.

Myself included before coming to AAD! Debt can make you feel so low!
But you are taking control here and yes THIS INFORMATION IS IMPORTANT because the Loan CCA may well be EN but it wasn't New money. It was a Consolidation Loan for existing Debts hence being Unsecured! As an example the Tesco Credit Card Debit with an UE CCA was one of those Debts!

There is also the irresponsible lending claim!
All of this is important in your dealings with Intrum. Remember Intrum when they brought the Debts had minimal information!
Remember Good Diaries make for good decisions!
If or when Intrum progress against you with say a Letter Before Claim (LBC) then contact Colin G Quinn the first consultation is free.
Refering back to your Diary!
Silence with Intrum and refer back here for any letters etc that they send!
AAD is a Great Place to be!!

[dmdm85]

Intrum won't know you have requested from Tesco's Agent Westcot a CCA and that what you received was UE.
Does the DSAR show summary figures and or dates against the default notices and or the sum of arrears entries? I
I explain the CCA is very precise about the contents and format of Default Notices and Sum of Arrears. You can't presume from an entry that the Default |Notice and or Sum Of Arrears was correct in format and in dates and figures!
The Loan CCA may or may not be EN but if this was known by Tesco to have been used to pay off existing Debt. Then the question arises as to whether that prior Debt was UE or not. Its called dressing a turd.

Not sure if this is important information or not but when I was going through the SAR paperwork I also went through bank statements from when the loan was received to see what existing debt was paid off with it, I have this listed below.

Existing Santander personal loan £13,600 (settled)
Tesco bank Credit Card £5000 (the other account now with intrum)
Barclaycard credit card £2000 (currently with PRA)
MBNA credit card £600 (still with MBNA)

So in total over £21,000 of this was used to pay existing debt. I know it sounds bad but I kind of forgot where it all went as I was so lost in it all at the time.

It may also be worth noting that when I first started getting in to difficulty I made an irresponsible lending claim which eventually the ombudsman went in favour of Tesco bank. All the correspondence for this was in the SAR. The reason for this being that I was surprised to get a personal loan if that size when I already had an existing loan with a £13,600 balance through Santander. I guess if I put that the reason for the loan was to pay existing debt then Tesco bank would have not taken the other loan in to consideration when lending. Apologies I appreciate this is a lot more information to take in but going through the SAR has jogged my memory in other areas that may be of importance.

[Roger]

Thanks for the reply. Could you explain what the relevance is that I have evidence wescot contacted Tesco bank? Sorry I'm just a bit confused how this helps me. Also what specific details am I looking for in the default notices and sum of arrears? Again with regards to the unsecured loan I don't really understand what difference it makes what the loan was used for. Apologies for all the questions I just want to try and make sure I am understanding all this.

Intrum won't know you have requested from Tesco's Agent Westcot a CCA and that what you received was UE.
Does the DSAR show summary figures and or dates against the default notices and or the sum of arrears entries? I
I explain the CCA is very precise about the contents and format of Default Notices and Sum of Arrears. You can't presume from an entry that the Default |Notice and or Sum Of Arrears was correct in format and in dates and figures!
The Loan CCA may or may not be EN but if this was known by Tesco to have been used to pay off existing Debt. Then the question arises as to whether that prior Debt was UE or not. Its called dressing a turd.

[dmdm85]

Now this is important you have the evidence that Wescott contacted Tesco re CCA. That is very important!
A Unsecured Loan of this size is highly unusual. But this was used to repay (in part ) existing Debt. This is very important it means in part this wasn't NEW money.

Does the DSAR give particulars of these Default Notices , Sums in Arrears. Precise wording is very important with these Notices and also they should have been delivered by Snail MAIL. Always remember that the CCA 74 is essentially a Snail Mail legislation. Especially for the delivery of key Documents/Notices.

Thanks for the reply. Could you explain what the relevance is that I have evidence wescot contacted Tesco bank? Sorry I'm just a bit confused how this helps me. Also what specific details am I looking for in the default notices and sum of arrears? Again with regards to the unsecured loan I don't really understand what difference it makes what the loan was used for. Apologies for all the questions I just want to try and make sure I am understanding all this.