Pra Group & unenforcability

[creditcritter]

Hi I have had my problems with Pra running on another thread for a while now I seem to be hitting a brick wall as far as advice how to finally shut it down any advice is welcome as I am sure many others have had the same experience with Pra Group, the account was originally an Mbna /Abbeycard

over two years ago I got a letter from Pra to say that Aktiv Kapital had now changed its name to Pra Group pay us the money so I did a Cca request they
said they could not honour my request & would not be contacting me again , some months later I got another demand , I again requested a Cca they sent me a blurred box application with t&c`s from 2002 the alleged account was opened in 2003 , I wrote & told them they had not satisfied my request they sent the same with the year pen doctored to read 2003, the t&c`s do not match 2003 neither interest rates or charges, ping pong letters for a period of time , my thoughts are that the Cca has not been satisfied, next move from Pra they passed it to there solicitors for either collection or action, the account was sold to Varde in 2010 as they have now gone down the tubes I cannot get a Cra from them, I have however requested & received Cra`s from Mbna & Pra Group no where on those documents dose it log any purchase from Varde although strangely the Mbna paperwork show an entry stating that they re assigned the debt to Pra Group in February this year yet it is clearly logged that they sold the debt account closed in 2010

[creditcritter]

Seems a lot of deaf ears these days

[Pat]

Hi
I have always found that responding to letters and emails only encourages them to continue writing etc.

I will see if I can find the other thread to get a handle on it

[Pat]

I am guessing you are in Scotland - is that correct ?
I ask because I know nothing about proceedings in Scotland

However from what I read the owner of this debt ( you or your wife?) have been sent a letter before action by solicitors

Did you respond to that ?

You have also been advised by Di to send SAR requests to MBNA and to PRA- have these come back?

Diana Mayhew

[creditcritter]

I have wrote above I have both Cra's Mbna & Pra Group the Cra's show no purchase entry regarding Pra buying the debt, if they had it would show on the information supplied on the paperwork , the debt that was originally sold to Varde in 2010 that is clearly shown in the Mbna Cra paperwork , a strange entry though later in the Mbna paperwork they reassigned the debt to Pra in February this year they cannot do that as they sold it in 2010 , I have asked Brodies there solicitors to show me proof that Pra actually own the debt as it is shown nowhere they have asked there client to supply proof & have put things on hold until it arrives .

[Pat]

Hi
When you say Cra do you actually mean SAR ( Subject Access Request)?

MBNA could re assign the debt to PRA if it was returned by varde although I would expect the SAR to show something about that
Of course, maybe it was not actually fully sold to varde , without seeing the deeds who can tell

There are always lots of ifs and buts when dealing with debt but if all they have sent you is a signature box and Niddy has said it is UE I would kinda leave things be - especially of the solicitirs have put it on hold pending info from the creditor

[creditcritter]

Sar yes it was sold to Varde it is clearly shown as sold on the print out 2010 Aktiv / Pra claim they bought it in 2012 no record of it so not owned by Mbna since 2010

[creditcritter]

Varde went out of business last year Pra where previously Aktiv Kapital I think they are so lost in there paperwork files they are chancing there arm Pra also make a separate claim that they bought the debt a couple of years ago from Abbey/ Mbna (M6 ) so they claim to have bought it twice , Mbna claim to have sold it in black & white in 2010 then re assign it this year to Pra whose kidding who the paper trail is all over the place as well as an unreadable application box wiithnterms & conditions from another year as well as being fraudulently altered by pen.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

the paper trail is all over the place as well as an unreadable application box wiithnterms & conditions from another year as well as being fraudulently altered by pen.

I would be very careful of accusing anyone of "fraudulently" altering documents. Fraud is a criminal offence.

Di

[Pat]

We know that PRA have problems proving assignments but I don't know the technicalities. The whole system of assignments is far more complicated.

Additionally a SAR only has to provide personal details , for example the ICO has ruled the agreement is not necessarily part of a SAR

You really need to let it go- wait for the next move rather than giving yourself high blood pressure but getting all worked up over it

Trust me on that one, I know from experience- you can have a million what ifs and it may still not go to plan

As Di said- DO NOT GO ON ABOUT FRAUD- very dangerous territory

[creditcritter]

Di I have the first copy I was sent & the second which was clearly altered , I am waiting on Brodies getting back to me they gave out things on hold until there client gets back to them with proof of ownership , just a further note about Mbna selling the debt it clearly says debt sold full amount mentioned at sale mentioned no further mention until February this year when alleged debt re assigned , will wait on the next move, my main objective is to settle for as little as possible.

[creditcritter]

a fresh update after receiving Sar`s from Mbna & Pra Group nowhere dose it show them purchasing the debt, I have been arguing this point the only thing they can produce is a letter from there previous name Aktiv Kapital passing them the debt no proof of purchase anywhere they are now sticking to there guns & have said court papers have been issued without so much as will you come to an agreement, I have offered to negotiate a f&f settlement but they are saying it might be to late , I thought the whol;e idea was to get money back for the debt owed.

[Spud]

Without knowing the full details of the case and without saying too much on a public forum, I would advise you to tread very carefully with sending them any further letters and probing things such as debt purchasing/assignment/fraud etc. If you have received the paperwork that you describe and they advise that court papers have been issued then further letters will be of no use. Sometimes less is more and the less said up front can pay off when there are time pressures of court action.

Just keep all that paperwork safe and advise if a claim does arrive

[creditcritter]

I am trying to make a full & final settlement to save court costs & solicitors fees , my belief is that they are playing on the fact that they have had a name change , the letter states they have awarded there new name Pra with all rights to collect , it is my belief that Aktiv just kept collecting when Varde went down & nobody questioned it , a new name Pra appears & hey no trail , Aktiv give a debt they have never purchased to Pra?

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I have been arguing this point the only thing they can produce is a letter from there previous name Aktiv Kapital passing them the debt no proof of purchase anywhere they are now sticking to there guns & have said court papers have been issued without so much as will you come to an agreement, I have offered to negotiate a f&f settlement but they are saying it might be to late , I thought the whol;e idea was to get money back for the debt owed.

It appears that PRA have taken the view that they're tired of arguing with you and are happy to see you in court.

That doesn't necessarily mean negotiations to settle are over, it means they're upping the pressure by issuing proceedings.

Since this is your wife's debt and you live in Scotland then she will be served with the Initial Writ by a Sheriff's officer.

Di