Landlord did not protect deposit

[downnotout]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

The original land lord is the son in law of the property owner. The property owner lacks mental capacity and he moved her in with them and rented out her house to pay for her up keep. In the mean time social services removed her from their care due to neglect and financial abuse. The house owner now resides with another daughter, who has just got lasting power of atourney, who has come forward as the person now responcible for the property. Today I got confirmation from new landlord about this, however original land lord wants me to ignore this and continue to pay him. The confusion is that there are two issues here, one being the safety of my deposit and secondly who is legally entitled to my rent. The name on the account I have been given is that of the property owner. Where I stand with my deposit is something I still need to sort out, my gut feeli g is that I have seen the last of it, which leaves me starting a new assured short hold tenancy with no deposit.

[SXGuy]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Personally, it still sounds as though they are trying to drag you in to their family tit for tat, the guy wants you to pay him, you got a letter saying pay the sis in law etc, this is all crazy stuff, your a tennant, you just want to know who to pay and is your deposit safe. not play family games.

Personally, i would look at it as, who owns the propety? the mother in law, who has POA? the daughter in law, i would therefore conclude that its her you pay.

Its true that anyone can collect the rent for the mother in law, in fact a few of my clients have properties in their sons names, but collect rent on their behalf, they even claim the property as their rental income and pay tax on it. Its all above board there.

But i find it hard to believe that any landlord would allow a tennant without a deposit, so it begs the question, what reason do they have to say you didnt pay one? I wouldnt let that one go.

Finally, you previously mentioned that the mother in law was removed from the son in laws property, do to neglect and Financial abuse?

Could this financial abuse also include, spending your deposit money and denying all knowledge of it? sounds likely to me!

[downnotout]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

SXGuy, it's all a nightmare, and I am worried about my deposit it's a lot of money. But do I tr and get it back off the previous land lord? Or do I leave it to the new land lord and insist that they claim it through there solicitor.

[jen_br]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

OK you know who to pay now... however the issue of the deposit needs sorting.

YOu should have some sort of bank record or at least withdrawl record of the money?

I would write a letter send it recorded to the landlord/POA asking them to confirm in writing that you paid a deposit.

explaining you have proof of payment and that this must be confirmed to you in line with the landlord deposit laws this country has.

[PlanB]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

The key thing here is whose name is on your tenancy agreement ?

If a solicitor is involved you're lucky because you can approach the firm to sort this out Even though he is instructed by the family (probably MIL) he has at least written to you direct so you have reason to reply.

I expect behind the scenes he is attempting to recover any money due to Mother-in-Law from Son-in-Law. This may include all rent paid by you so far including your deposit. The solicitor will probably be grateful to you if you can identify this money and give him the evidence. Do you have a paper trail of what you have paid so far and to whom with bank statements to support this ? If that identifies the deposit (was it equivilent to one month's rent?) then you can ask the solicitor to acknowledge this and get it insured for you. I'm sure he will.

Alternatively you can ask for a *rent free month* and have that confiemd in writing by the solicitor and proceed to the end of the tenancy without a deposit. It's not obligatory to pay one and it's the Landlord who gets the advantage if you do not the Tenant.

If you tell me whose name is on the AST I can make further suggestions but until them I'm boxing in the dark If you can answer any of my questions in post # 8 that would be brilliant

[downnotout]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

The name on the original tenancy agreement was that or MR S-I-L. All rent up to this point was paid by standing order in to his daughters account. I have a print out of ALL rent paid in to this account. What I do not have is a paper trail for my deposit. That was paid in cash (told that it secured the property.
Assured Shorthold Tenancy made out for 12 months, ending this Saturday.
What contract? only given AST, with MR S-I-L name and address
I have been paying in to S-I-L daughters account
Picked the property out of classified section local paper, no agent involved.
No I have not been served notice, and No I didn't get a deposit receipt.
And the documentation on the LPA states that the property is the M-I-L's.

[jen_br]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

This is a widely done in canada too you pay dep of first and last month

[SXGuy]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

The issue i see is you paid the deposit in cash, got no receipt for it, and got no tennancy agreement to sign when you first moved in.

Someone else may be able to help, but its def a hard battle.

[downnotout]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

I did sign the tennancy when I first moved in. The part where it says about the deposit is tippexed out. In its place is....

In advance £475. First payment, giving one months payment in advance.

This is hand written. To the left of this in the notes for guidance, it talks about the deposit scheme.

Further information about the Government authorised Tenancy Deposit Schemes can be obtained from their websites: ......

[PlanB]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

The name on the original tenancy agreement was that or MR S-I-L. All rent up to this point was paid by standing order in to his daughters account. I have a print out of ALL rent paid in to this account. What I do not have is a paper trail for my deposit. That was paid in cash (told that it secured the property.
Assured Shorthold Tenancy made out for 12 months, ending this Saturday.
What contract? only given AST, with MR S-I-L name and address
I have been paying in to S-I-L daughters account
Picked the property out of classified section local paper, no agent involved.
No I have not been served notice, and No I didn't get a deposit receipt.
And the documentation on the LPA states that the property is the M-I-L's.

Thanks for the extra info because this is now beginning to make more sense

Firstly it appears that the SIL may have committed fraud This will obviously be a good bargaining tool for you over the return of any money which may be owed to you when dealing with the solicitor. If he is not the owner of the property then I would say he has no legal right to create a tenancy agreement and collect money under that contract (aka an AST) unless he is acting in a formal capacity as *agent* (or Power of Attorney) for the owner. If a Landlord is acting as POA this has to be stated in the tenancy agreement and I presume it isn't. If he had no formal authority then he has probably committed a criminal offence. If not fraud (which I think it is) it would be *obtaining money by deception*. Getting him sent to prison will not get you your money back sadly. But pressure on the solicitor will help because once he has been made aware of a possible criminal offence he has a duty not to ignore it

Why your Landlord had the money paid into his daughter's bank account (tax reasons probably or to distance himself from any potentional allegation of criminal activity since he didn't actaully profit from any fraud) doesn't help you either unless his daughter was the owner (she wasn't) or their *agent* (I don't think so!).

Moving on to the "deposit". You say that it was described as money "to secure the property". Could your Landlord claim that this was simply a "holding deposit" This is where the Landlord (or their agent) hold on to a sum of money from the Tenant while the paperwork is being drawn up, which the Tenant would forfeit if they pulled out of the deal at the last minute. Most letting agents take one or two weeks' rent as a holding deposit which is then offset against the first amount of rent due. You need to check your statements to see whether you have paid 11 or 12 months rent so far (not counting that "deposit"). If you've paid 12 then he has kept your intial down payment whatever it was for.

If the Landlord has been crafty and not taken a *deposit against dilapidations* (as defined including the exact sum in the AST) but just the one to secure the property then he probably has no legal duty to insure anything. But he also has no right to hold on to your *holding deposit* in the alternative.

I'm more worried that your AST expires in 48 hours and without a a new one you are vulnerable to being asked to leave and no notice needs to be given. Strictly speaking you should be served a section 21 Notice giving you 2 months' Notice which expires on the last day of your AST (this Saturday) even though it's for a 12 month Fixed Term. If that hasn't happened then you can stay there as a Periodic Tenant until served a section 21 Notice of two months. Or you need only to give only one month's notice since you pay your rent monthly. Either has to be served on or before the next rent due date (Saturday?) or any subsequent rent due date.

Sorry it's such a long post but I'm doing my best to explain in order to protect the roof over your head as well as your money

[PlanB]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Mods.

I wonder if any of you think this thread belongs in the Consumer Rights section or even Everything Legal since it's definitely heading in that direction Downnotout does seem to be battling legal contract issues with his rogue Landlord

[SXGuy]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Post removed as PlanB said it all really lol

[PlanB]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Post removed as PlanB said it all really lol

Oh no please put it back SXGuy. I'm not the only one to have an opinion and what if I've got it all wrong You also have massive experience of property rentals from a different perspective. I'm a Landlord - but not a rogue one I hasten to add

[PlanB]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Thread moved to 'Everything legal' which is only visible to forum members.

Which just happens to include our preferred solicitors

[downnotout]

Re: Landlord did not protect deposit

Thanks guys, I'm so fucked off with all of this, I'm getting to the point where I hope I'm made homeless just so that I can be free of all of this shit. I don't really swear all that often but I am fed up.