Legality/enforceability of the various responses to a letter before claim

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

I hope I didn't say anything in that call that scuppers my chances . . . . I did say I planned to fill in their forms and make an offer to resume monthly payments?

. . . . I need to feel sure I can quickly retreat and stay on positive terms with them if they come up with an enforceable CCA.

That said I am now reminded this is a credit card not a loan and is pre April 2007.

You may recognise the debt as a credit card not a loan but Idem may have no idea what it was so don't give them any clues.

Send a s 77-79 CCA Request today. There's no advantage in waiting.

Make sure you refer to s77 (loans) and s78 (credit cards) in your request so as not to help fill in any gaps in Idem's knowledge

I wouldn't worry about the phone call since you are more than five years away from your Statute Barred goal. Just don't make or take any calls from them in future. Hopefully your call has lulled them into a false sense of security so they don't try to hard to comply with your CCA Request.

If they come up with an enforceable credit agreement then you can evaluate the situation again. They'll have to come up with a lot more than the agreement to be certain of enforcing the debt in court.

One step at a time. You're getting there.

Di

[Roger]

5th June plus 30 days equals Thursday 5th July 2018. This is when the LBC needs to be in their hands! So you could post a reply (recorded deliver) say Tuesday 3rd July at the latest.

If you haven't yet sent off for CCA I suggest you do this say Wednesday 20th June (Recorded Delivery enclosing Postal Order for £1). Should be in their hands say 22nd June ( that's exactly 14 days before the Letter Before Claim needs to be in their hands) After 14 days without the CCA its UE. So you can honestly Fill in the LBC "outstanding CCA request" and nothing more.
AAD Template https://www.all-about-debt.co.uk/for...%20Request.doc

The CCA S.77/78 letter sets out the legal position
"..
If this information is not provided within 12 working days the debt becomes unenforceable. This means a creditor cannot:
· make the debtor pay the debt before they're supposed to
· get a court judgement against the debtor
,,"

[linnite]

5th June plus 30 days equals Thursday 5th July 2018. This is when the LBC needs to be in their hands! So you could post a reply (recorded deliver) say Tuesday 3rd July at the latest.

If you haven't yet sent off for CCA I suggest you do this say Wednesday 20th June (Recorded Delivery enclosing Postal Order for £1). Should be in their hands say 22nd June ( that's exactly 14 days before the LBC needs to be in their hands) After 14 days without the CCA its UE. So you can honestly Fill in the LBC "outstanding CCA request" and nothing more.

We have ALL been where you are and thought the same way. I followed the National Debt guidance lines etc.. etc.. The various Charitable advice etc..
In my own case overnight the valued Creditor becomes the impoverished Debtor. Bullish is an apt description of how you then become treated!

DCA's backed by investors. They buy BAD Debts as an Investment. So they are Investing in you and curiously as a good Creditor!!!!!.
They are Not a Charity neither are they doing a Public Service. The Debt has been written Off and the Banks enjoy Tax benefits etc.. During the Banking Crisis the Banks were bailed out by the Tax payer (that's you and I) your tax paying for these bad debts and the same time being harassed (legally) by DCA for the same bad debts!

Churchill famous comment on those that wanted to negotiate with Hitler "you can't negotiated with a Tiger whilst your Head is in Its Mouth!"
There is no such thing as being on positive terms with DCA and how are you going to retreat when they are mauling over what the pitiful small amount of spare income you now have?

The Consumer (that's you and I) Law is for Our protection and benefit. Failures here on the part of the Creditors is Uneforcibilty in one form or another.

The AAD way is the Consumer Law and Silence. Everything in writing. No phone Calls which admit perhaps inadvertently the Debt.
How do you know that this debt is enforcible OR that they have the legal right to sue for the debt?

Thanks again for all this Roger, can you just explain what the advantage is to sending the CCA letter later, rather than now?

[linnite]

Can I just clarify

In post 1 you say this is a loan but from your diary you said it was a credit card. The difference might be crucial.

In either case, did you have ppi, this might have been asked before.

From my own diary (!) it appears it was a credit card. I was always very good at saying no to PPI so in a case like this if it turns out I had it it was definitely missold, being unaware I even had it! But no, I'm actually pretty decent with figures and read statements carefully and don't remember PPI being on anything but a Picture loan that I got a nice refund on via the FCA redress scheme, and a Vanquis card my partner had.

[linnite]

If statute barring is all I might have scuppered, then I won't worry, as I am 5 years 8 months away from SB anyway. So long as through my words I can't have rendered an unenforceable contract, enforceable, and that sounds pretty unlikely as I type it, then I should be OK.

I've drafted a CCA letter, I guess I should send it then?

[Warwick65]

Can I just clarify

In post 1 you say this is a loan but from your diary you said it was a credit card. The difference might be crucial.

In either case, did you have ppi, this might have been asked before.

[Warwick65]

Yes, here is a much better place to talk UE. Yes I think we are bullish but sometimes you have to be. IF the telephone call you made was recorded it could be seen as an admission with regard SB. That is why, personally I almost never communicate on the phone. But what’s done is done and it’s moving on. I’m not sure when you stopped paying, if you have but getting the cca off is important.

Remember from now until a CCJ is a long way and there are probably many opportunities to set up repayments before judgement if you need to.

[linnite]

Thank you. I did post something very similar on Debt Camel, because I visit there about some complaints I have in with the FOS. I'm sure here is the more appropriate for enforceability, etc, matters.

[Warwick65]

Hi

I suspect I answered your post on Debt Camels blog, if so I am glad you are here and nowhere else.

My Halifax loan was unenforceable because it was incorrectly executed and therefore there was nothing they could do. I think at the time i told them what it was flawed but not how and I didn’t hear from them again. The debt is now SB

To try and give you support, when I started my journey , I was told most of my agreements were enforceable yet only 1 out of over 20 actually tried to take me to court and they failed thanks to Di and Joanna Connolly so it goes to show there is a lot more than ‘just’ a s77-79 request.

[Roger]

Letter dated 5th June, landed on my doormat on the 8th. I'd better mention I have telephoned them in response, to check what was supposed to happen next. I hope I didn't say anything in that call that scuppers my chances, I certainly didn't say anything as specific as 'I acknowledge I owe this money'. I did say I planned to fill in their forms and make an offer to resume monthly payments?
Everyone is quite bullish about doing the enforceability route in this case, but I need to feel sure I can quickly retreat and stay on positive terms with them if they come up with an enforceable CCA. I wouldn't be able to pay off a CCJ so I'd be stuck with it for 6 years.
That said I am now reminded this is a credit card not a loan and is pre April 2007.

5th June plus 30 days equals Thursday 5th July 2018. This is when the LBC needs to be in their hands! So you could post a reply (recorded deliver) say Tuesday 3rd July at the latest.

If you haven't yet sent off for CCA I suggest you do this say Wednesday 20th June (Recorded Delivery enclosing Postal Order for £1). Should be in their hands say 22nd June ( that's exactly 14 days before the LBC needs to be in their hands) After 14 days without the CCA its UE. So you can honestly Fill in the LBC "outstanding CCA request" and nothing more.

We have ALL been where you are and thought the same way. I followed the National Debt guidance lines etc.. etc.. The various Charitable advice etc..
In my own case overnight the valued Creditor becomes the impoverished Debtor. Bullish is an apt description of how you then become treated!

DCA's backed by investors. They buy BAD Debts as an Investment. So they are Investing in you and curiously as a good Creditor!!!!!.
They are Not a Charity neither are they doing a Public Service. The Debt has been written Off and the Banks enjoy Tax benefits etc.. During the Banking Crisis the Banks were bailed out by the Tax payer (that's you and I) your tax paying for these bad debts and the same time being harassed (legally) by DCA for the same bad debts!

Churchill famous comment on those that wanted to negotiate with Hitler "you can't negotiated with a Tiger whilst your Head is in Its Mouth!"
There is no such thing as being on positive terms with DCA and how are you going to retreat when they are mauling over what the pitiful small amount of spare income you now have?

The Consumer (that's you and I) Law is for Our protection and benefit. Failures here on the part of the Creditors is Uneforcibilty in one form or another.

The AAD way is the Consumer Law and Silence. Everything in writing. No phone Calls which admit perhaps inadvertently the Debt.
How do you know that this debt is enforcible OR that they have the legal right to sue for the debt?

[linnite]

Hello

Don't let a Letter Before Claim unsettle you. And don't tick any boxes until the facts are known!

I'll take a peek at your Diary for the backstory but if you haven't already sent a s 77-79 CCA Request then now would be a good time (once the situation has been analysed). Don't do anything yet.

What is the date on the LBC so the deadline can be established? That's the first thing needed.

Di

Letter dated 5th June, landed on my doormat on the 8th. I'd better mention I have telephoned them in response, to check what was supposed to happen next. I hope I didn't say anything in that call that scuppers my chances, I certainly didn't say anything as specific as 'I acknowledge I owe this money'. I did say I planned to fill in their forms and make an offer to resume monthly payments?

Everyone is quite bullish about doing the enforceability route in this case, but I need to feel sure I can quickly retreat and stay on positive terms with them if they come up with an enforceable CCA. I wouldn't be able to pay off a CCJ so I'd be stuck with it for 6 years.

That said I am now reminded this is a credit card not a loan and is pre April 2007.

[Still Waving]

Thanks Di.

I had difficulty finding my own diary a few days ago.

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

You say you do have a diary, can you provide a link to it, please?

Here you go > https://www.all-about-debt.co.uk/for...innite-s-diary

And here's the relevant updated post >

Re: linnite's diary

4. Halifax CC, £6500 originally now £3200 paid down via DMP, taken out Nov 2006 default date Dec 08, Blair Oliver and Scott administer, again don't think this has been sold?

Mar 2018: This was sold to Idem. Very little correspondence from them. Now £2,372.

June 2018: Received letter before action.

Di

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Well the name that springs to mind is Di!

. . . Di professional can be contacted (first contact is free) when you have marshalled the paper work! Should that be necessary.

Hello

Don't let a Letter Before Claim unsettle you. And don't tick any boxes until the facts are known!

I'll take a peek at your Diary for the backstory but if you haven't already sent a s 77-79 CCA Request then now would be a good time (once the situation has been analysed). Don't do anything yet.

What is the date on the LBC so the deadline can be established? That's the first thing needed.

Di

[Still Waving]

Hi

You say you do have a diary, can you provide a link to it, please?