Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

[PlanB]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

they are now applying for a full charging order on the field on which I am applying for planning permission !

. . . . The CCJ is my ex wifes and at last she is coming around to the fact that we need to talk or she will lose everything

I am going to defend the application as a joint owner of the property Will the court let me do this?

This ongoing issue continues on a new thread in the Legal section here > http://forums.all-about-debt.co.uk/s...l=1#post483872

I wouldn't want anyone to think we'd suddenly stopped helping

Plan B x

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

Well I won costs at £19/hour and had the number of hours reduced but no order for sale

BUT!!!!!!! ARGHHHH

they are now applying for a full charging order on the field on which I am applying for planning permission !

The planning application is now 3 weeks old the planning agents are very optimisic (they have spent upwards of £50k to get it to this stage and I only pay them if they gain planning approval)

The CCJ is my ex wifes and at last she is coming around to the fact that we need to talk or she will lose everything

I am going to defend the application as a joint owner of the property Will the court let me do this??


the solicitors have yet again lied or at least mislead the court in the application by not telling the court of all other known creditors of ex so I think I have a good defence

onlymeagain

[Undercover Elsa]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

Congratulations on your victory ohitsonlyme!!

In respect of costs, the amount a LiP can claim is set by Statute. Currently it's £18 per hour, which increases to £19 per hour from 6th April 2015: http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

WON!!!!!!! Got a call yesterday from ex wifes solicitor saying that following my defence they are prepared to withdraw their application for an order for sale,
They realise they wont win at court and also that would claim costs

at the end of the longish conversation I asked rather politley "and as to the issue of costs??"
A flabergasted solictor didnt know what to say

I want them to withdraw totally and believe they have behaved despicably.
Should I press for Costs
My estimation shows £490 minimum
see below

costs statement
Rate Claimed Litigant in Person rate of £30.00 / hour the rate at which I charge my time as a self-employed director of a building company@ £250 per day


1) Time spent identifying and understanding relevant legislation.
Time spent identifying and understanding relevant case law.
Time spent preparing skeleton argument and witness statement

15 hours @£30.00= £450.00

2) Time spent communicating with the claimant

1 hours @£30.00 =£30.00

3/ Disbursments, postage typing etc. £10.00

Total £490.00

Notes

Before undertaking this myself I approached a solicitor to handle this. I was given an estimate of 3 to 6 hours at £175/hour to prepare the witness statement (£525-£1050)+vat plus extra for attending the court.

I respectfully request that the court give consideration to awarding these costs on the indemnity basis or, in the alternative, on the standard basis as I believe, in any case, that they have been proportionately and reasonably incurred and/or are of a proportionate and reasonable amount.

In support of this request, I would also like to refer the court’s attention to the authority of the High Court in the case of:-

Hammonds (a firm) v Pro-Fit USA Ltd [2007] EWHC 1998 (Ch)

In this case, Mr Justice Warren confirmed that it was usual for an indemnity award to be made:-

Onlyme again

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

Well the gloves are off
I received a letter of claim asking for an order for sale from ex wifes solictors.

I intend to fight this but dont know the procedures involved Yet!!
hearing date is 25 January

The house and land are on 2 separate title deeds

The restriction is only on the deeds to the house not the land

what do I have to do in terms of defending the claim and witness statements.

The valuation that they have used is incorrect, they have valued the house and land but only have a restriction on the house.

They havent mentioned a second restriction in favour of HMRC

They havnt mentioned my beneficial claim on the property and I am listed as the defendant which I will of course defend


They havent mentioned the tenants in situ including children

They have not been able to gain details of the balance outstanding to the building society which without planning and the field is close to the value of the mortgage outstanding

I think I can get it rejected and possibly costs from them(that would be fun)

Can the court still order the sale for the other creditors at this hearing if this application fails on technicalities??

onlyme again

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

Im not hung up about an amount

I cannot pay her off unless we both agree how to arrange it

Weve not even got the planning application in yet!!

The way she wishes to complicate things, will make it all fall down, we need to do this together with each others interest at heart

There really is not much I can or want to update with on this aspect of the problem

Can I stop a charging order being moved on to an order for sale?? Is my first priority

2nd priority is sorting out how much we might get in the event of gaining planning permission

[PlanB]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

I like your style plan b and understand where you are coming from

That's because I'm an embittered ex-wife so I know exactly what's going through your ex-wife's head at the moment. My divorce lasted longer than my marriage so I've got plenty of experience in this area.

It's never about money, it's always about emotions. Maybe your ex-wife doesn't want closure because she'll miss having you around if that happens. As long as you are tied together by that property deal you'll never be rid of her. She knows you need her to sign documents and agreements so she enjoys having power over you.

Pay her off if you can, and the sooner the better. Don't be too hung-up on whether the amount you have to pay or promise to pay is fair or not. If it buys you your freedom it'll be worth every penny.

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

I rather doubt that she would be able to afford the fees.

I agree clever clogs I think the threat comes from getting hmrc or solicitors to do it for her
I know that she won't as she wants the 500k that is on the table!

I am working on understanding how to buy her beneficial interest with a jv or finance partner if the worst happened

[CleverClogs (RIP)]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

she threatens going bankrupt

I rather doubt that she would be able to afford the fees.

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

Never mind your ex-wife. If there is a court application for an Order for Sale on a property which you co-own you'll be able to raise your own reasons for opposing it which may include questioning those solicitors' costs.

I like your style plan b and understand where you are coming from :-)

[PlanB]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

I can see the sense in challenging the fees unfortunately ex wouldn't

Never mind your ex-wife. If there is a court application for an Order for Sale on a property which you co-own you'll be able to raise your own reasons for opposing it which may include questioning those solicitors' costs.

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

I can see the sense in challenging the fees unfortunately ex wouldn't

The threat is one of her main cards, I am fairly confident that she will want to get something rather than nothing so I need patience and the knowledge to be able to fight off any potential outside threat

Could i apply to the courts to get the promo agreement signed?

I fostered 7 children in total 3 siblings for 15 years with emergency care for others along the way
By the time I am 70 which isn't too far away I will have had children under the age of 15 living with me for 47 years!

I have had a fabulous life and look and feel many many years younger than I am so I plan to be around for a long long time

[PlanB]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

What a lovely story so far. I'm thrilled to learn that you've finally got a child of your own and to know that you've been a foster parent says a lot about your good nature.

There's lots to debate, but I must say quickly that the only reason I mentioned your ex-wife's possible challenge to her solicitor's hellish legal costs is because any investigation of them may help to prevent an Order for Sale if the firm decides to go down that route. It would be a curved ball to play for time. Who cares if she's right or wrong about the charges.

[ohitsonlyme]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

I am playing very nicely ex is being vindictive towards me and my wife.

We both hold the same cards but I am less worried than she if i have to wait

My costs were low as I did most of the proceedingI myself and only used a solicitor when i had to

Unfortunately I cant help her to challenge her costs as she wont believe that I am trying to help her

She is being difficult because she thinks I have been living the high life on her money when the truth is just the opposite, I have had to start again and am working hands on as a builder,i havent missed a day and am beginning to build up a very good reputation via the my Builder website

Ex had close on £100,000 to buy a hair salon and ran it into the ground within 12 months to such a degree that I had to go and manage it and sold it for £30000 (which ex recieved) She thinks that I had money to start other businesses and wont accept that I did no money down property deals

I am not feeling pressure I have a good life with a lovely wife and 4 years ago at the age of 55 had my first child now a beautiful bright 4 year old who dotes on her daddy,after nearly 30 years of parenting other peoples children foster children, step children, none of my own til now

We dont have a lot of extra money compared to what i used to have and I am fighting the DCAs on a regular basis with help from this site, but we are better of than lots of folk.

I am one of 8 kids so not having much doesnt stress me out,I want to help ex and myself get closure

ex is being greedy or not accepting the truth around the recession, she believes that I am being greedy,and she wants £200,000 more than me and will not split everything 505/50 I will not give in to her demands and she wont give in to mine

STALEMATE!!
with a chance we could both walk with little or nothing


ex was on income support when i met her I had a substantial amount of equity in property and grew this whilst together(only 6 years) so for every year of being together even at 50/50 ex will get iro £100,000 for each year and never worked other than mum to her 3 children and house wife, I do not hold this against, her we married so she should get 50% thats how things roll

She is desperate for money now she does have a rare disease and the only income is from me £400/m and rent free house, I really am not prepared to give in even though she is in a bad place

I will attempt to talk to her solicitors to understand their position. I dont believe they can enforce further but need to be prepared if they do want to push it.


I now have to be patient and wait.

The conversations by email get more and more frought and now ex says she wont sign despite her needs she threatens going bankrupt or that her solicitors are going for an order for sale

I can wait I would prefer not to. I am 60 next year and want to spend my time with my wife and daughter as comfortably as I can

I suppose I am sharing with people that I trust on this site and value previous advice given on unenforceability etc

sometimes another point of view that is unbiased cant high light flaws in my approach.

[PlanB]

Re: Restrictions ex wife and planning gain

There are 2ccj my ex gained, with restrictions, in my ex name only.

a solicitors bill for £23,000 this is what she is threatening with.

. . . She is in a desperate place and I am pretty sure she will see sense at some point and I really do want to help her even if I have to apply to the courts (can I apply for her to sign the promotion agreement?)

Thanks for the extra information. There are several things going on here which although interlinked need to be treated separately.

Firstly it sounds as if the solicitors want an Order for Sale to get their hands on their obscene £23k bill. I'm assuming these costs were all in relation to the divorce proceedings which were concluded without any court order for money stuff. If that's the case then there is no court order for you to pay you ex-wife's legal costs from your share of the equity in the property when it's sold, that money will come from her share since it's her debt alone.

Your ex-wife's £23k for divorce costs contrasts significantly with your £2k costs which means you either (a) had a cheap solicitor or (b) did a lot of the work yourself.

There's always the possibility that her solicitor has overcharged her massively (they milked the situation while she was vulnerable) and there is a remedy for that. All legal costs can be assessed by the court and this may be something she can look into in order to get that bill reduced. The court will scrutinize every penny charged and adjust the bill accordingly. Solicitors can send a whopping bill but you don't have to pay it all if it's not reasonably incurred.

Your ex-wife can use the Legal Services Ombudsman to complain about the way her divorce was handled by her solicitor and they will consider her bill as part of that investigation. A lot depends on the timing as you say you separated six years ago but not how long ago you were divorced and your ex-wife would have been presented with the final bill. The LOS has a time limit which includes nothing which went wrong before the LOS was set up.

Although you may think your ex-wife is being awkward it's actually her solicitors who are threatening you not her. They are piling on the pressure to get their grubby hands on the money.

You are feeling under pressure because you want to get the planning deal done and dusted for which you need her co-operation. This is not a time to fall out because she is holding all the cards at the moment. You need to play nicely to get what you want.