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  • Florida Jens diary

    Ok here we go. 6 debts in total so I will try and do a post for each.

    be gentle with me I am a newbie to this site

    Debt 1
    • Type of account (credit card/loan) Barclaycard
    • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) ???
    • Approx balance. Approx 7000
    • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) 2013
    • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till June 2018
    • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
    • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. PRA group



    2013
    statement received paid minimum payment
    statement received nil paid
    letter received stating they didn't receive payment

    2014
    statement received stating payment received via Stepchange
    same every month for rest of year
    letter sent advising situation not changed
    letter received saying thank you for letter payments will stay same

    2015
    statement
    statement
    letter received section 87 (1)

    2016
    statement from PRA

    2018
    Stopped payments via Stepchange want to go Self managed
    May CCA request made
    postal order sent back with letter stating account on hold
    ​​​​​​ letter from PRA stating unenforceable
    letter received stating enclosed copy docs as requested. Received reconstituted copy, terms and conditions and a copy statement.


    I emailed Niddy who advises unenforceable

    APOLOGIES NOT IN COLOURs I am on an iPad and don't know how to do?

    Letter received 4th September along with numerous phone calls to which we have not answered....

    Letter asks if we can settle account and giving three option
    pay a discount price (couple hundred off)
    three monthly instalments
    six monthly instalments

    please call us to arrange .......

    what should we do please??
    would ideally like the calls to stop
    Last edited by Floridajen; 6th September 2018, 19:34.

  • #2
    Well that's good news. You haven't actually said when you opened the account , the CCA response should give you a clue.

    The fact PRA have told you it is unenforceable is a letter you need to keep

    Just a couple of questions

    1) Are you still paying?
    2) Did the letter from PRA say it was unenforceable while they were locating the agreement and since then they have sent one?

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi. Thanks for reading.

      in answer to your questions
      1) have not paid for two months now since I sent CCA
      2) first letter said while they look for letters etc it is unenforceable then the following day !! a letter was sent with reconstituted copy and copy statements

      i have looked at agreement date on PRA letter and this state's 08/05/2001.

      Comment


      • #4
        Now is the time to send SAR/GDPR`s to
        1/ Stepchange
        2/ Barclaycard.
        You need to fill in a lot of background details here with both Barclaycard and PRA.
        As Warwick points out PRA are known to come back with located agreements!!

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Roger View Post
          Now is the time to send SAR/GDPR`s to
          1/ Stepchange
          2/ Barclaycard.

          My advice is the OP should not send anything to anyone until the full facts are known.

          Di
          Legal Disclaimer

          I am a Litigation Executive at Joanna Connolly Solicitors a firm which specialises in consumer credit. If you need to contact me you can send a message by clicking on my username or by emailing me at di@joannaconnollysolicitors.co.uk or by telephoning 0330 053 9340. Our initial advice is always free.

          Any posts I make on the AAD Consumer Forum are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide on the forum is without liability. If you are unsure please seek formal legal guidance or contact your local citizens advice bureau at https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Floridajen View Post
            1) have not paid for two months now since I sent CCA
            2) first letter said while they look for letters etc it is unenforceable then the following day !! a letter was sent with reconstituted copy and copy statements

            If PRA have sent you a reconstituted copy of your credit agreement in response to your s77-79 CCA Request then I suggest you email that to Niddy for an opinion on whether it's likely to be enforceable or unenforceable.

            Email it to webmaster@all-about-debt.co.uk.

            EDIT - I see you've already done that and the verdict was the agreement is unenforceable

            Di
            Last edited by Diana Mayhew; 11th July 2018, 23:40.
            Legal Disclaimer

            I am a Litigation Executive at Joanna Connolly Solicitors a firm which specialises in consumer credit. If you need to contact me you can send a message by clicking on my username or by emailing me at di@joannaconnollysolicitors.co.uk or by telephoning 0330 053 9340. Our initial advice is always free.

            Any posts I make on the AAD Consumer Forum are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide on the forum is without liability. If you are unsure please seek formal legal guidance or contact your local citizens advice bureau at https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Warwick65 View Post
              You haven't actually said when you opened the account , the CCA response should give you a clue.

              As I understand it the CCA response from PRA indicates that the account was opened on the 8th May 2001 which may be a clue.

              Whether that's true or not is another matter


              Originally posted by Floridajen View Post
              a letter was sent with reconstituted copy and copy statements

              i have looked at agreement date on PRA letter and this state's 08/05/2001.
              Di
              Last edited by Diana Mayhew; 11th July 2018, 23:36. Reason: typo
              Legal Disclaimer

              I am a Litigation Executive at Joanna Connolly Solicitors a firm which specialises in consumer credit. If you need to contact me you can send a message by clicking on my username or by emailing me at di@joannaconnollysolicitors.co.uk or by telephoning 0330 053 9340. Our initial advice is always free.

              Any posts I make on the AAD Consumer Forum are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide on the forum is without liability. If you are unsure please seek formal legal guidance or contact your local citizens advice bureau at https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Roger View Post
                PRA are known to come back with located agreements!!

                This is true.

                But in the case of PRA Group (UK) Ltd v Diana Mayhew (me ) the two credit agreements they produced were deemed irredeemably unenforceable by the judge (Recorder) in court so the claim was lost >


                Originally posted by Joanna Connolly View Post
                ‘“RECONSTITUTED AGREEMENT” – IRREDEEMABLY UNENFORCEABLE
                “UNREDACTED DEEDS OF ASSIGNMENT – NO ASSIGMENT PROVED”


                So, held Recorder Bellamy in PRA Group (UK) Limited v Mayhew at Central London County Court on 22nd March 2017, at the end of a 3 day multi track trial, when dismissing PRA’s claim against our client.


                Stale debts sued for on the back of 2 ‘reconstituted’ MBNA credit card agreements (May 1999 and October 2000) were held irredeemably unenforceable under CCA 1974. The evidence of an honest witness was preferred to that of so called “reconstituted agreements”.


                After 3 days of close forensic examination of, and legal argument about, evidence and documents from both PRA and MBNA stating that our client’s specific debt had been assigned, the court held that no assignment had been proved.


                Efforts, over many months, in earlier cases to force PRA into disclosure of un-redacted deeds and deep and sustained forensic challenge to the provenance of documents needed to prove regulatory compliance, finally drew back the veil. The reality behind bulk debt purchasing was revealed.


                This decision shows that just saying an agreement is enforceable and producing a “reconstituted” copy does not prove that it is enforceable. Just saying an agreement has been assigned and producing a notice saying it has been assigned does not prove legal assignment.


                Debt purchasers need to provide proof. If that means the pitifully few pence in the pound they pay for stale debts will increase because banks will now have to start keeping original evidence complying with regulatory consumer protection measures, it is hard to imagine many tears being shed, outside the City of London.
                Di
                Legal Disclaimer

                I am a Litigation Executive at Joanna Connolly Solicitors a firm which specialises in consumer credit. If you need to contact me you can send a message by clicking on my username or by emailing me at di@joannaconnollysolicitors.co.uk or by telephoning 0330 053 9340. Our initial advice is always free.

                Any posts I make on the AAD Consumer Forum are for information and discussion purposes only and shouldn't be seen as legal advice. Any advice I provide on the forum is without liability. If you are unsure please seek formal legal guidance or contact your local citizens advice bureau at https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk

                Comment


                • #9
                  Debt 2
                  • Type of account (credit card/loan) Overdraft Barclays
                  • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) accounts opened 20+ years ago
                  • Approx balance. 1500
                  • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) ??
                  • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till 2018
                  • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                  • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. Barclays collections




                  2014
                  June letter from BARCLAYS received stating payment received via Stepchange
                  October letter from BARCLAYS Received stating payment received and accepted from Stepchange

                  2015
                  Letter received asking for 12 monthly review
                  Letter received accepting payments from Stepchange
                  letter received accepting new payments ( 90p more)

                  2016
                  Letter received thanking me for letting them know Stepchange are dealing with payments!
                  Letter accepting payments from Stepchange

                  2017
                  letter asking for 12 month review
                  letter accepting payment from Stepchange (£5 less)


                  2018
                  letter accepting new payment (80p more)
                  ​​​​ I sent a CCA not realising you cannot for overdrafts.
                  Letter sent by me offering F&F of £150.00
                  letter received stating not prepared to accept offer. Will reconsider if I can increase or provide further evidence of situation.
                  I sent letter offering £175.00 as a F&F
                  letter received stating again not prepared to accept etc... as before


                  What should I do next folks? Thanks
                  ​​​​​​
                  Last edited by nightwatch; 6th September 2018, 11:45.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Debt 3
                    • Type of account (credit card/loan) Barclayloan Plus
                    • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) 20th October 2011
                    • Approx balance. £3000
                    • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) 2013
                    • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till 2018
                    • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                    • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. PRA Group


                    2013
                    letter received from Barclays advising I had cancelled the DD
                    letter received advising missed a payment
                    Letter received Notice of Default section 87 (1)
                    letter received advising receipt of payment proposal


                    2014
                    letter received Arrears Notice
                    letter received Arrears Notice
                    statement received
                    letter received stating receipt of offer of payment
                    letter received Arrears Notice

                    2015
                    letter received Arrears Notice
                    letter from Barclays Arrears Notice
                    letter received from Barclays 12 month review
                    letter received advising they are in receipt of payment from Stepchange
                    ​​​​​​
                    ​​​​​​
                    2016
                    Arrears Notice received
                    Arrears Notice received
                    letter received from Barclays thanking us for providing details of Stepchange
                    letter received from Barclays advising offer of payment received
                    received from Barclays advising transfer to PRA Group
                    statement received from Barclays
                    letter received from Barclays saying transfer now complete
                    letter received from PRA Group saying they purchased debt
                    letter received from PRA Group section 86B

                    letter received from PRA Group statement of account

                    2017
                    letter received from PRA Group statement of account

                    2018
                    I sent a CCA request with £1 postal order
                    letter received back from PRA Group returning PO and account on hold
                    letter received from PRA enclosing copy documents as requested.

                    (sent all to Niddy who thinks enforceable)
                    ????


                    Next steps please ? Thanks


                    Letter received 4th September along with numerous phone calls to which we have not answered....

                    Letter asks if we can settle account and giving three option
                    pay a discount price (couple hundred off)
                    three monthly instalments
                    six monthly instalments

                    please call us to arrange .......

                    what should we do please??
                    would ideally like the calls to stop
                    Last edited by Floridajen; 6th September 2018, 19:39.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Next step a GDPR SAR to Barclays.
                      Was there any PPI?
                      What is the background to this Loan?
                      Does the name Mercer appear in any of your documents?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Debt 4
                        • Type of account (credit card/loan) MBNA Card
                        • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) ????
                        • Approx balance. £5500
                        • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) 2013
                        • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till 2018
                        • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                        • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. LINK Financial
                        2013
                        letter received from MBNA advising account restricted as we told them about financial situation
                        Accepting payment from Stepchange

                        2014
                        letter received from MBNA notice of sum in arrears
                        Again as above
                        Again as above
                        Default notice 87(1)
                        letter asking if financial situation has changed
                        letter received Notice of sum in arrears
                        letter stating credit agreement terminated
                        letter advising they are selling account
                        letter received from Link advising they have account now
                        letter received from Link advising offer received to them via Stepchange

                        2015
                        letter received from Link statement of account

                        2016
                        letter from Link statement of account
                        letter from Link statement of account

                        2017
                        letter from Link statement of account
                        letter from Link statement ofaccount

                        2018
                        I sent CCA request with PO for £1
                        NO reply as yet



                        ​​​​
                        Last edited by Floridajen; 14th July 2018, 23:25.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Debt 5
                          • Type of account (credit card/loan) Barclaycard
                          • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) ????
                          • Approx balance. £1900
                          • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) 2013
                          • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till 2018
                          • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                          • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. PRA Group
                          2013
                          statement received from Barclaycard
                          letter received thanking me for letting them know about stepchange

                          2014
                          Monthly statements received
                          letter from Barclaycard advising they have had payment offer from stepchange

                          2015
                          Monthly statements received
                          Default letter 87 (1)
                          letter from Barclaycard Formal Demand
                          as above
                          letter advising account transferring to PRA Group
                          letter advising account now closed
                          letter from PRA Group saying they have purchased account

                          2016
                          letter from PRA statement of account

                          2017
                          Letter from PRA account summary

                          2018
                          I sent CCA request with £1 PO
                          I received PO back with PO account of hold
                          letter from PRA enclosing some documents but stating unenforceable
                          letter enclosing copy documents as requested
                          emailed to Niddy - he thinks UE

                          Thanks for any help ---- 5 down 1 more debt to add - sorry if you are all bored x


                          Letter received 4th September along with numerous phone calls to which we have not answered....

                          Letter asks if we can settle account and giving three option
                          pay a discount price (couple hundred off)
                          three monthly instalments
                          six monthly instalments

                          please call us to arrange .......

                          what should we do please??
                          would ideally like the calls to stop
                          Last edited by Floridajen; 6th September 2018, 19:41.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Floridajen View Post
                            Debt 2
                            • Type of account (credit card/loan) Overdraft Barclays
                            • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) accounts opened 20+ years ago
                            • Approx balance. 1535.85
                            • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) ??
                            • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till June 2018
                            • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                            • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. Barclays collections



                            2014
                            June letter from BARCLAYS received stating payment received via Stepchange
                            October letter from BARCLAYS Received stating payment received and accepted from Stepchange

                            2015
                            September letter received asking for 12 monthly review
                            October letter received accepting payments from Stepchange
                            October letter received accepting new payments ( 90p more)

                            2016
                            September letter received thanking me for letting them know Stepchange are dealing with payments!
                            September letter accepting payments from Stepchange

                            2017
                            August letter asking for 12 month review
                            August letter accepting payment from Stepchange (£5 less)


                            2018
                            January letter accepting new payment (80p more)
                            ​​​​9th May I sent a CCA not realising you cannot for overdrafts.
                            1st June Letter sent by me offering F&F of £150.00
                            14th June letter received stating not prepared to accept offer. Will reconsider if I can increase or provide further evidence of situation.
                            25th June I sent letter offering £175.00 as a F&F
                            3rd July letter received stating again not prepared to accept etc... as before


                            What should I do next folks? Thanks
                            ​​​​​​
                            If you are looking for a full and final settlement you would need to show them that a) You can not afford to be paying and b) the total offered is reasonable and based on pro rata to all your creditors.

                            So for example you may want to send an Income and Expenditure carefully and accurately worked out THAT SHOWS a minimal monthly surplus income that when divided pro rata would give them pence per month followed by a letter explaining where the lump sum had come from e.g a relative is prepared to lend me the money and how it would work out across all your creditors at whatever % you offer.

                            My personal feeling is that when you just write and offer a lump sum they will think you have more and are trying it on. Also remember everytime you write you are acknowledging the debt

                            I do wonder if at the moment if a general GDPR request to barclays for everything they holdmight not be a bad idea.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Floridajen View Post
                              Debt 3
                              • Type of account (credit card/loan) Barclayloan Plus
                              • Date commenced (ideally before Apr 2007) 20th October 2011
                              • Approx balance. £3219.27
                              • Date last paid (approximate date you last made a FULL payment) September 2013
                              • Are you on arrangement or not paying. Was paying Stepchange till June 2018
                              • Status (default/in arrears/up-to-date) Default
                              • Account owner (who is writing to you, a DCA or the lender. DCA. PRA Group
                              2013
                              November letter received from Barclays advising I had cancelled the DD
                              November letter received advising missed a payment
                              November letter received Notice of Default section 87 (1)
                              December letter received advising receipt of payment proposal


                              2014
                              January letter received Arrears Notice
                              June letter received Arrears Notice
                              October statement received
                              October letter received stating receipt of offer of payment
                              November letter received Arrears Notice

                              2015
                              April letter received Arrears Notice
                              September letter from Barclays Arrears Notice
                              September letter received from Barclays 12 month review
                              October letter received advising they are in receipt of payment from Stepchange
                              ​​​​​​
                              ​​​​​​
                              2016
                              February Arrears Notice received
                              July Arrears Notice received
                              September letter received from Barclays thanking us for providing details of Stepchange
                              September letter received from Barclays advising offer of payment received
                              September received from Barclays advising transfer to PRA Group
                              October statement received from Barclays
                              November letter received from Barclays saying transfer now complete
                              November letter received from PRA Group saying they purchased debt
                              December letter received from PRA Group section 86B
                              December letter received from PRA Group statement of account

                              2017
                              December letter received from PRA Group statement of account

                              2018
                              14th May I sent a CCA request with £1 postal order
                              18th May letter received back from PRA Group returning PO and account on hold
                              26th June letter received from PRA enclosing copy documents as requested.
                              (sent all to Niddy who thinks enforceable)

                              Next steps please ? Thanks
                              Not a lot to do at the moment , maybe have a look at the DN from 2013 to see if it is compliant- there are lots more ways to deal with a loan than just the agreement. As its 2011 though, it might be a little more troublesome

                              Comment

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