CCA Advice PRA Wescott/Link and NCO

[Lifeback]

Just quick update to say I received a letter from Wescott telling me they havent had their payment from my DMP. I have sent it to Niddy to be sure. On another note I have stopped paying Stepchange, I just cancelled the direct debit two months ago, they haven't contacted me and I haven't contacted them, to be honest it slipped my mind until now. Should I formally close the DMP or just let it go?

[nightwatch]

you may want to let them know you have decided to go self managed, you will need information off them regarding who owns what, along with what is still owing

[Lifeback]

Good point Nightwatch, I will get on to that. In the meantime PRA Group called the house, my father said I wasn't there and they told him to tell me t get in touch. I'm a little concerned as I am not staying there at the moment and don't want my father to be hastled, even though at the age of 80 he's up for it! (I'm quite suprised by that!) have you any advice on the best way forward as this is the nightmare that I really didn't want :-(

[nightwatch]

i am afraid PRA can be like a dog with a bone, won't leave it alone,
maybe they spoke to your father in a tone he didn't like, my mum was the same, her favorite reply was, If I remember when I next see them.
Even when her dementia was bad she would answer the phone, If she realised it was the phone ringing, say WHAT!, WHO?, never heard of them.

An old school friend phoned her looking for me, she told them that hubby and I had moved to Japan and were running an english tea shop.Friend found me on face Book. I often wonder how that would of gone down with some DCA's

[Lifeback]

Gosh I love the Japan reply, that's superb! Since your reply I have also had a text message from Wescott asking me to contact them I have no idea howthey got my number. Having two of them actively chasing me is rather unnerving, I'm guessing I just ignore them?

[The Tech Clerk]

wescott ignore for now they are commission agent only

[Warwick65]

Gosh I love the Japan reply, that's superb! Since your reply I have also had a text message from Wescott asking me to contact them I have no idea howthey got my number. Having two of them actively chasing me is rather unnerving, I'm guessing I just ignore them?

Yes ignore them. You could blacklist the number on your mobile and if they start to call do not engage in conversation- I am sure I don't need to tell you this.

If it becomes tiresome then send the telephone harassment letter (I can't remember what it says exactly what it says but I would include a line about communicating only in writing). I think the last one I sent even listed the numbers they had been calling and a few dates and times . It did the trick.

Agai not sure what they are like now but 4 years ago ish they were really not that bright. They even referred me to the credit consumer act - so I replied to them asking where I could get a copy :-) .(At that point I was past caring so don't necessarily follow my lead)

[Lifeback]

Thank you so much for this information its really reassuring. The worst part of this is it feeling like it did in the beginning with them all hassling me all the time so to get two out of three trying to contact me within days was really quite scary. I think all I want is to get to the stage where I reaad newbie threads on here and can reply 'chill, it's nothing.....they're just flexing their protien shake muscles to try and scare you'

[The Tech Clerk]

Just push button human robots. And a lot of programs auto mad. Hoping you ring and then they will look at screen. Nevertheless never ring

[The Tech Clerk]

Harassment by Telephone if and when you need to use it?

[Lifeback]

Thank you Tech Clerk and sorry for the late reply. Life has been chucking a few rubbish bins at me for the last couple of months but seems to be smoothing out now. However, just as i wa thinking I hadn't heard anything on the debt front for a while and feeling rather smug two letters arrived, one not so nice from PRA and the other is a notice of sums in arrears from Link, have sent both to the wonderful Niddy and await his adivce......how do these companies get their timing so good eh?

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

two letters arrived, one not so nice from PRA and the other is a notice of sums in arrears from Link, have sent both to the wonderful Niddy and await his adivce......

No need to send Niddy any letters you receive unless they contain a credit agreement for him to check.

Post up about the not-so-nice letter from PRA. Can you also quote the debt history if it's on this thread which helps to put things in context when suggesting your next step.

Di

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

PRA

Type of Account: MBNA Credit Card
Date Commenced: 1998
Balance: 2800
Date of Last Full Payment: August? 2011
Arrangement: DMP via Stepchange
Status: Just stopped paying this month
Account Owner: PRA

02/01/20 CCA requested
20/01/20 Reply saying they are awaiting further documents and currently deem this debt as unenforceable. (copies of my credit card statements were included with this letter)
21/01/20 Letter received with ilegible copy of CCA plus plain paper copy of terms and conditions. I wrote back asking for a better copy (doh!)
14/02/20 Letter received teling me they have requested the required information and the account is on hold and all further collections activity will cease until further notice
Early march 2020 Second ilegible copy of CCA recieved (identical to first), I wrote back asking for a better copy again (double doh!)
06/03/20 Letter received saying they have requested a copy from MBNA but that MBNA dont have any alternative copies. They go on to say they consider the debt ENFORCEABLE??
25/03/2020 Reply from Niddy saying he would say the CCA agreement is UE as he cannot read it too well, it is iledgible and couldn't be emailed to a solicitor. Advice is to wait and see what they do next.
20/05/2020 Telephone call from PRA while I was away, they left a message to contact them.
10/06/2020 Letter from PRA giving me 30 days to contact them or be considered for litigation. Have forwarded to Niddy.
10/06/2020 Super fast reply from Niddy to say to ignore.
23/07/2020 Letter from PRA advising my account has now been transferred to the Investigations and Litigation department. It says it is a letter before claim and constitutes a formal demand for payment and also to be treated as an invitation to refer to mediation or alternative dispute resolution. Its a bit scary, jumps from veiled threat to we want to help, and have passed on to Niddy to cast his eye over.

I see you have received a Letter of Claim from PRA according to your edited post above.

Is that correct?

Di

[Lifeback]

Hi Di,
I'm afraid I dont know what a letter of claim is as I've never had any legal dealings in my life before now but the letter says:

We write further to our previous letter sent to you (which asked me to get in touch regarding the debt or my account would be paassed to the Investigations and Litigation Department which Niddy said to ignore) that my account has now been transferred to the Investigations and Litigation Department. This is a Letter Before Claim as required by the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct & Protocols contained in the Civil Procedure Rules. This letter constitutes a formal demand for payment and to give you notice of PRA Group's intention to issue Court proceedings against you.'.....

It gives me 30 days to respond with the reply forms giving boxes as to whether I agree I owe the debt/I owe some of the debt/I don't know whether I owe the debt/I dispute the debt. It also has sections on whether I will pay/need time to pay/provide a financial statement and that I am getting or intend to get debt advice .

[Joanna Connolly Solicitors]

Hi Di,

I'm afraid I dont know what a letter of claim is as I've never had any legal dealings in my life before now but the letter says:

. . that my account has now been transferred to the Investigations and Litigation Department. This is a Letter Before Claim as required by the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct & Protocols contained in the Civil Procedure Rules. This letter constitutes a formal demand for payment and to give you notice of PRA Group's intention to issue Court proceedings against you.'

If you would like my input you can email me PRA's Letter of Claim using di@joannaconnollysolicitors.co.uk (no need to include the I & E pages). I'd like to see what they are intending to claim and why they think they have the right to claim it.

A Letter of Claim states their intention to issue legal proceedings, but that's not the same as winning the case in court and getting a CCJ against you.

PRA took me to court and lost as Jo explains here >

‘“RECONSTITUTED AGREEMENT” – IRREDEEMABLY UNENFORCEABLE”
“UNREDACTED DEEDS OF ASSIGNMENT – NO ASSIGNMENT PROVED”


So, held Recorder Bellamy in PRA Group (UK) Limited v Mayhew at Central London County Court on 22nd March 2017, at the end of a 3 day multi track trial, when dismissing PRA’s claim against our client.


Stale debts sued for on the back of 2 ‘reconstituted’ MBNA credit card agreements (May 1999 and October 2000) were held irredeemably unenforceable under CCA 1974. The evidence of an honest witness was preferred to that of so called “reconstituted agreements”.


After 3 days of close forensic examination of, and legal argument about, evidence and documents from both PRA and MBNA stating that our client’s specific debt had been assigned, the court held that no assignment had been proved.


Efforts, over many months, in earlier cases to force PRA into disclosure of un-redacted deeds and deep and sustained forensic challenge to the provenance of documents needed to prove regulatory compliance, finally drew back the veil. The reality behind bulk debt purchasing was revealed.


This decision shows that just saying an agreement is enforceable and producing a “reconstituted” copy does not prove that it is enforceable. Just saying an agreement has been assigned and producing a notice saying it has been assigned does not prove legal assignment.


Debt purchasers need to provide proof. If that means the pitifully few pence in the pound they pay for stale debts will increase because banks will now have to start keeping original evidence complying with regulatory consumer protection measures, it is hard to imagine many tears being shed, outside the City of London.

Di